Jan. 5, 2026

Terrible Tommy: The life & Crimes of Thomas Silverstein

Terrible Tommy: The life & Crimes of Thomas Silverstein
Apple Podcasts podcast player badge
Castro podcast player badge
RSS Feed podcast player badge
Apple Podcasts podcast player icon Castro podcast player icon RSS Feed podcast player icon
Season 9

In this episode of “Bloody Angola Podcast”, Jim explores what many consider the most dangerous inmate ever incarcerated in the United States prison system, Thomas “Terrible Tommy” Silverstein.  Labeled a brutal killer and Aryan Brotherhood leader, Silverstein spent the last 36 years of his life in solitary confinement—the longest such stint in federal Bureau of Prisons history—under “no human contact” conditions at facilities like USP Marion and ADX Florence in Colorado. 

Chapters
03:29 The early life of Thomas Silverstein.
07:18 First incarceration.
11:37 Rise of the Aryan Brotherhood.
13:36 The first murder and its consequences.
14:36 Transfer to Marion and a new beginning.
21:21 The killing of Officer Clutts.
22:25 Life means life.
26:08 Transfer to ADX Florence.
29:25 Silverstein's lawsuit.

Join Bloody Angola on Patreon for Commercial Free Early Releases and more here: www.patreon.com/bloodyangolapodcast

For Louisiana Local Advertising inquiries or to book appearances please email BloodyAngola@gmail.com

WEBVTT

1
00:00:05.480 --> 00:00:23.719
M m A Wall Street line, shackle change, Oh someome gird,

2
00:00:25.920 --> 00:00:32.240
it's calling my name. There is no mercy and it's

3
00:00:32.359 --> 00:00:42.119
been a tentery juice as the huge stream game Wrangle three.

4
00:00:42.719 --> 00:00:43.439
Come here.

5
00:00:46.039 --> 00:00:54.719
By me or die inside these walls, inside the wild.

6
00:00:56.240 --> 00:01:32.159
And went no girl as I'm hey everyone, welcome back

7
00:01:32.200 --> 00:01:35.200
to Bloody and Gola, a podcast one and forty two

8
00:01:35.280 --> 00:01:38.840
years in the making, the complete story of America's bloodiest prison.

9
00:01:39.159 --> 00:01:43.319
I'm Jim Chapman and this should be the first episode

10
00:01:43.359 --> 00:01:46.719
that I have recorded since the New Year. So Happy

11
00:01:46.760 --> 00:01:49.920
New Year to all of you out there listening to

12
00:01:49.959 --> 00:01:52.799
Bloody and Gola. I hope you got some good goals

13
00:01:52.799 --> 00:01:55.719
set for twenty twenty six, I'm looking forward to bringing

14
00:01:55.760 --> 00:02:01.719
you the best in prison podcast asking telling you the

15
00:02:01.840 --> 00:02:06.680
notory stories of Louisiana State Penitentiarating in Goola. And we're

16
00:02:06.719 --> 00:02:09.719
gonna add some other prisons into the mix as we

17
00:02:09.800 --> 00:02:13.199
go along, and that's sort of what we're doing today.

18
00:02:13.599 --> 00:02:16.039
And look, I will be the first to tell you

19
00:02:16.560 --> 00:02:21.479
Louisiana State Penitentiarating Gola a very dangerous place, and honestly,

20
00:02:21.800 --> 00:02:26.599
most maximum security prisons in the United States same way. Now,

21
00:02:26.680 --> 00:02:32.280
what makes them dangerous is not so much the prisons themselves,

22
00:02:32.439 --> 00:02:38.360
although that helps. It's also those who inhabit those prisons. Now,

23
00:02:38.400 --> 00:02:42.159
as you know, maximum security prisons throughout the United States,

24
00:02:42.199 --> 00:02:46.120
they don't house jaywalkers, they don't house people who receive

25
00:02:46.680 --> 00:02:50.199
speeding tickets that they hadn't paid, those sorts of things.

26
00:02:50.520 --> 00:02:56.120
These prisons are full of murderers, rapists, major drug dealers,

27
00:02:56.680 --> 00:03:00.280
the worst you can think of in society. Now, in

28
00:03:00.719 --> 00:03:05.319
maximum security prisons there is a hierarchy shot callers, if

29
00:03:05.360 --> 00:03:09.120
you will. In a place full of dangerous people, these

30
00:03:09.199 --> 00:03:13.919
shot callers are considered the most dangerous. So I got

31
00:03:14.000 --> 00:03:16.759
curious and I went down I guess kind of a

32
00:03:16.840 --> 00:03:20.639
rabbit hole of who people in the know would consider

33
00:03:21.240 --> 00:03:26.039
the most dangerous prisoner ever in a max security prison.

34
00:03:26.120 --> 00:03:30.719
And of course that's a very subjective question. Everybody's going

35
00:03:30.800 --> 00:03:34.360
to have a different opinion. But the name that would

36
00:03:34.439 --> 00:03:38.879
surface frequently in my research was an inmate by the

37
00:03:38.960 --> 00:03:43.800
name of Thomas Silverstein, who went from a teenage robber

38
00:03:44.159 --> 00:03:49.560
to becoming a high ranking member of the Aryan Brotherhood. Now,

39
00:03:49.560 --> 00:03:52.560
his path would lead to a string of murders within

40
00:03:52.639 --> 00:03:57.919
the walls of max security prisons and eventually an unheard

41
00:03:57.960 --> 00:04:03.000
of thirty five year I'm in solitary confinement in a

42
00:04:03.039 --> 00:04:07.039
supermax prison. So he's going to be our subject for today.

43
00:04:07.120 --> 00:04:09.120
And I'm going to start off by telling you a

44
00:04:09.199 --> 00:04:13.560
little bit about Thomas Silverstein's early life. Now, he was

45
00:04:13.719 --> 00:04:18.920
born Thomas Conway in Long Beach, California. This was on

46
00:04:19.000 --> 00:04:24.040
February fourth of nineteen fifty two. His mother divorced her

47
00:04:24.160 --> 00:04:28.160
first husband while she was still pregnant with Thomas, and

48
00:04:28.240 --> 00:04:32.480
she married another guy. His name was Thomas Conway, which

49
00:04:32.720 --> 00:04:38.160
young Tommy would claim as his biological father. So eventually

50
00:04:38.399 --> 00:04:41.839
she divorces Conway and then she marries a guy by

51
00:04:41.839 --> 00:04:45.839
the name of Sid Silverstein. And that's where Thomas got

52
00:04:45.839 --> 00:04:48.319
his last name Silverstein. And I know a lot of

53
00:04:48.319 --> 00:04:53.120
this information is a lot to keep up with. She's

54
00:04:53.120 --> 00:04:56.439
already married three times, right, he's very young, but it's

55
00:04:56.480 --> 00:04:59.600
important to the story. And you could already see that

56
00:04:59.639 --> 00:05:04.120
there's a a lot of instability in Thomas's early life.

57
00:05:04.279 --> 00:05:09.560
Now that being said said, Silverstein was pretty financially stable,

58
00:05:09.720 --> 00:05:13.000
and Thomas would grow up in the fifties in the

59
00:05:13.120 --> 00:05:17.959
early sixties and what you would consider a middle class

60
00:05:18.120 --> 00:05:23.560
neighborhood in Long Beach, California. Now, Thomas was not what

61
00:05:23.680 --> 00:05:27.800
you would consider a typical kid growing up. He was

62
00:05:27.920 --> 00:05:32.560
very timid, shy, kind of awkward. So he would get

63
00:05:32.600 --> 00:05:36.160
picked on a lot. He just came across as a target.

64
00:05:36.360 --> 00:05:39.639
And because his last name was Silverstein, even though that

65
00:05:39.800 --> 00:05:43.600
wasn't his birth name, kids would assume he was Jewish.

66
00:05:43.879 --> 00:05:47.120
And this was at a time in history when Jewish

67
00:05:47.240 --> 00:05:50.879
kids got picked on, and in later interviews he would

68
00:05:50.959 --> 00:05:55.519
say they would bully him relentlessly about the fact that

69
00:05:55.600 --> 00:05:58.680
he had a Jewish last name, even though he was

70
00:05:58.759 --> 00:06:02.600
not Jewish. Now, due to this bullying, he would run

71
00:06:02.639 --> 00:06:05.399
home a lot. He was scared of these bullies. He

72
00:06:05.399 --> 00:06:08.480
would freak out, run home, cry to his mom, and

73
00:06:08.560 --> 00:06:12.399
his mom, Virginia, in an effort to toughen him up,

74
00:06:12.759 --> 00:06:15.199
would tell him that he would either need to face

75
00:06:15.360 --> 00:06:18.920
down these bullies and stand up to them, or she

76
00:06:19.240 --> 00:06:22.160
was gonna whip his ass herself. And look, I don't

77
00:06:22.199 --> 00:06:25.480
think she meant anything negative with that. I think she

78
00:06:25.639 --> 00:06:28.759
was trying to toughen her son up. And that's just

79
00:06:28.839 --> 00:06:31.519
what Thomas did. He would face down the bullies and

80
00:06:31.560 --> 00:06:35.879
he would actually start fighting back and winning these fights. Now,

81
00:06:36.240 --> 00:06:40.319
this type of environment, it would harden Thomas very early

82
00:06:40.399 --> 00:06:44.759
in life. And in nineteen sixty six, at just fourteen

83
00:06:44.920 --> 00:06:48.560
years old, Thomas ends up in a reformatory, which is

84
00:06:48.639 --> 00:06:53.279
basically like a youth prison, after getting in some trouble.

85
00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:56.920
And it's not clear exactly what trouble that he had

86
00:06:56.920 --> 00:06:59.639
got into, but he ended up in a pretty harsh

87
00:06:59.759 --> 00:07:03.199
refe formatory. But one thing about youth prisons is you

88
00:07:03.279 --> 00:07:07.160
fight a lot. Even in today's day in time, you

89
00:07:07.519 --> 00:07:12.720
constantly are fighting inside juvenile lock up, right, And Thomas

90
00:07:12.759 --> 00:07:17.319
would fight nearly every single day inside of that youth prison.

91
00:07:17.399 --> 00:07:22.079
He would say later on. Now he does get released eventually,

92
00:07:22.279 --> 00:07:25.160
but it was not long before he was locked up

93
00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:29.879
yet again, and this time for armed robbery at just

94
00:07:30.279 --> 00:07:34.920
nineteen years old. And unfortunately, this time he gets sent

95
00:07:35.000 --> 00:07:37.600
to what you would call big boy prison and the

96
00:07:37.839 --> 00:07:42.879
infamous San Quentin. And this is in nineteen seventy one,

97
00:07:43.000 --> 00:07:46.839
and y'all, Sam Quintin was rough in those days. As

98
00:07:46.879 --> 00:07:50.399
a matter of fact, in the early seventies, Sam Quentin

99
00:07:50.600 --> 00:07:54.920
was dubbed as the quote war behind walls in the

100
00:07:55.120 --> 00:07:59.279
racial lines inside that prison ran really deep. But Silverstein

101
00:07:59.319 --> 00:08:02.680
would hone his his fighting skills further inside of Singing

102
00:08:02.720 --> 00:08:07.000
Quentin before being released some four years later. This is

103
00:08:07.040 --> 00:08:12.079
in nineteen seventy five, so he gets paroled, but he

104
00:08:12.199 --> 00:08:16.680
did not stay out long. In nineteen seventy five, his father,

105
00:08:16.959 --> 00:08:21.360
Thomas Conway and his cousin along with Silverstein, they pull

106
00:08:21.439 --> 00:08:26.480
off three armed robberies and they netted about eleven thousand

107
00:08:26.480 --> 00:08:30.959
dollars in these robberies combined, which that's about eighty five

108
00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:35.960
thousand dollars in today's money. But they get caught, and

109
00:08:36.000 --> 00:08:39.159
this is in nineteen seventy seven that it's off to

110
00:08:39.279 --> 00:08:44.320
prison again for Silverstein, this time to serve a fifteen

111
00:08:44.399 --> 00:08:48.159
year stint for armed robbery, and this time in an

112
00:08:48.200 --> 00:08:52.799
even more dangerous and infamous prison than Saying Quentin, as

113
00:08:52.840 --> 00:08:58.440
Silverstein is sent to the US Penitentiary in Levingworth, Kansas.

114
00:08:58.600 --> 00:09:02.600
So Levenworth will a bringing ground at this point in

115
00:09:02.679 --> 00:09:05.600
time for gangs, and this is where Silverstein will get

116
00:09:05.600 --> 00:09:09.200
a start with the AB, the Airy and Brotherhood. Now

117
00:09:09.279 --> 00:09:15.840
the AB is very notorious, a very violent white supremacist

118
00:09:15.960 --> 00:09:19.519
prison gang that has gained a lot of traction throughout

119
00:09:19.559 --> 00:09:22.919
the nation in prison, and many people don't realize, so

120
00:09:22.960 --> 00:09:26.360
it may surprise you to learn it's the oldest and

121
00:09:26.600 --> 00:09:30.879
deadliest prison gang in the United States. Now, Thomas Silverstein,

122
00:09:30.960 --> 00:09:34.320
he was already quite familiar with the AB because it

123
00:09:34.399 --> 00:09:37.720
was actually founded just ten years or so prior in

124
00:09:37.759 --> 00:09:41.559
his old stomping grounds. It's singing Quentin now. The AB

125
00:09:41.840 --> 00:09:46.240
was originally formed due to the deep segregation that exists

126
00:09:46.279 --> 00:09:51.080
in maximum security prisons, and this segregation it still exists today.

127
00:09:51.320 --> 00:09:54.480
For example, if you're a white inmate, you hang out

128
00:09:54.519 --> 00:09:57.879
with white inmates. If you're a black inmate, you hang

129
00:09:57.879 --> 00:10:01.440
out with black inmates. Latino who was hanging with latinos.

130
00:10:01.879 --> 00:10:04.799
It was like that then and it's like that now.

131
00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:07.879
You don't play cards, you don't lift weights, you don't

132
00:10:07.919 --> 00:10:12.279
even run laps with anyone outside of your race, or

133
00:10:12.440 --> 00:10:15.519
you could lose your race protection. As a matter of fact,

134
00:10:15.559 --> 00:10:19.480
you will. And most of these gangs, they actually operate

135
00:10:19.679 --> 00:10:23.120
within the prison with a lot of structure. As a

136
00:10:23.159 --> 00:10:25.919
matter of fact, the AB is known for their structure

137
00:10:26.000 --> 00:10:31.559
inside prison. They actually have a twelve man council, which

138
00:10:31.600 --> 00:10:34.279
is kind of like a border directors, and even a

139
00:10:34.440 --> 00:10:38.919
three man commission to make decisions. So the motto of

140
00:10:39.039 --> 00:10:43.159
the AB, the Areyan Brotherhood is blood in, blood out,

141
00:10:43.320 --> 00:10:47.000
which means to get accepted into the AB you have

142
00:10:47.080 --> 00:10:51.200
to commit an act of violence, many times murder, and

143
00:10:51.279 --> 00:10:55.039
to get out, well, there's really no getting out once

144
00:10:55.080 --> 00:10:59.240
you're in. Your technically in for life in membership can

145
00:10:59.279 --> 00:11:03.279
only end by death. Now with the AB, they offer

146
00:11:03.559 --> 00:11:06.679
I guess you could say a vast array of services

147
00:11:06.759 --> 00:11:11.360
criminal activity that would include drug trafficking, murder for hire,

148
00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:17.200
inmate prostitution, and a ton of other nefarious activities. And

149
00:11:17.320 --> 00:11:22.159
this would make them both very powerful and very dangerous

150
00:11:22.360 --> 00:11:26.799
within prison walls. Now, it was in Leavenworth that Thomas

151
00:11:26.840 --> 00:11:30.799
would really deepen his affiliation with the AB, and this

152
00:11:30.879 --> 00:11:35.960
would become apparent when Thomas murders a fellow inmate by

153
00:11:36.039 --> 00:11:39.879
the name of Danny Atwell. This was in nineteen eighty so,

154
00:11:40.000 --> 00:11:44.320
as the story goes, Thomas Silverstein along with an associate

155
00:11:44.519 --> 00:11:48.279
of the Arian Brotherhood named Eddie Hawk and another associate

156
00:11:48.320 --> 00:11:52.200
by the name of Charles McAvoy, they were part of

157
00:11:52.240 --> 00:11:57.279
a group that would smuggle drugs into Levenworth and Danny Atwell,

158
00:11:57.840 --> 00:12:01.000
he was an inmate that had been smuggling in marijuana

159
00:12:01.080 --> 00:12:04.559
for them to sell inside the prison. He didn't want

160
00:12:04.559 --> 00:12:08.440
to smuggle any drugs outside of that into prison. I'm

161
00:12:08.480 --> 00:12:12.000
not sure why. Maybe he was worried if he got caught,

162
00:12:12.200 --> 00:12:16.120
the sentence would be stiffer for a harder drug. But

163
00:12:16.320 --> 00:12:20.600
for whatever the reason, he just totally refused anything outside

164
00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:23.639
of marijuana they were wanting to get into, like speed

165
00:12:24.399 --> 00:12:28.080
and cocaine and all this stuff. Well, that pissed off

166
00:12:28.720 --> 00:12:33.120
the AB and Silverstein and his associates because they were

167
00:12:33.159 --> 00:12:37.000
making big money off of this. It pissed them off too.

168
00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:43.080
And according to the trial testimony, Silverstein and Hawk in particular,

169
00:12:43.200 --> 00:12:47.159
they enter at Well Sell and they just stab him

170
00:12:47.519 --> 00:12:51.559
to death with some chanks. This was on November one

171
00:12:51.960 --> 00:12:55.320
of nineteen eighty and this murder would change a lot

172
00:12:55.320 --> 00:12:59.399
of things for Silverstein. First, the murder would earn him

173
00:12:59.440 --> 00:13:04.399
the nickname quote Terrible Tommy, and it would also turn

174
00:13:04.519 --> 00:13:10.639
that fifteen year stent into life in prison when in

175
00:13:10.759 --> 00:13:14.240
nineteen eighty one he gets convicted of first degree murder

176
00:13:14.240 --> 00:13:18.000
of Danny atwell So how you like that for decision making?

177
00:13:18.080 --> 00:13:20.960
You're in there for fifteen years, I mean that's a

178
00:13:21.000 --> 00:13:25.960
short stint relatively speaking, and you commit a murder inside

179
00:13:26.000 --> 00:13:28.320
the walls to where you end up with life in

180
00:13:28.360 --> 00:13:31.600
prison just not very smart. It would also result in

181
00:13:31.759 --> 00:13:36.480
Thomas getting a reputation that would make him very feared

182
00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:42.840
even amongst the harshest inmates inside of Levenworth. So after

183
00:13:43.039 --> 00:13:47.639
killing inmate at Well, Thomas gets transferred to an even

184
00:13:47.720 --> 00:13:52.679
more dangerous prison than Levenworth in nineteen eighty one when

185
00:13:52.720 --> 00:13:56.759
he moves to the United States Prison at Marion, which

186
00:13:56.840 --> 00:14:00.000
at this point in time, y'all, this was the high

187
00:14:00.039 --> 00:14:04.919
I asked maximum security prison the Bureau of Prisons in

188
00:14:04.960 --> 00:14:08.600
the United States had. It was really the United States

189
00:14:08.799 --> 00:14:13.000
first supermax prison, even though it wasn't called that. Marion

190
00:14:13.159 --> 00:14:17.399
is located in southern Illinois and the prison was specifically

191
00:14:17.559 --> 00:14:22.399
designed to house the United States' most dangerous inmates. If

192
00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:27.039
you're curious about some people who of notable people that

193
00:14:27.120 --> 00:14:31.519
had been there, how about John Gottie, how about Nicky Barnes,

194
00:14:31.720 --> 00:14:37.120
Two very high ranking mobsters that ended up in Marion.

195
00:14:37.559 --> 00:14:40.000
So it's secure, to say the least. But as secure

196
00:14:40.039 --> 00:14:44.440
as Marion was, he could not stop Terrible Tommy from

197
00:14:44.559 --> 00:14:49.039
murdering yet again inside prison. When in nineteen eighty one,

198
00:14:49.559 --> 00:14:53.919
the same year that he got convicted in the Danny

199
00:14:54.120 --> 00:15:00.840
Atwell murder, he kills a rival gang member named Robert Chappelle,

200
00:15:00.879 --> 00:15:05.440
and he was a member of the notorious DC Blacks.

201
00:15:05.759 --> 00:15:09.519
In a little about the DC Blacks, this prison gang

202
00:15:09.799 --> 00:15:14.879
originated about five years after the AB formed, and originally,

203
00:15:14.960 --> 00:15:18.200
as you may have guessed, they were a gang consisting

204
00:15:18.240 --> 00:15:22.559
of inmates all from d C. But that kind of grew,

205
00:15:22.799 --> 00:15:26.679
it expanded and now, according to the reports I read,

206
00:15:26.799 --> 00:15:31.200
the largest black prison gang inside of prison. And they

207
00:15:31.200 --> 00:15:36.039
were also the Arian Brotherhood's primary rivals. So, as that

208
00:15:36.159 --> 00:15:42.200
story goes, Thomas Silverstein goes into Chappelle's cell, presumably while

209
00:15:42.200 --> 00:15:46.159
he's asleep, slips a wire around his neck and strangles

210
00:15:46.279 --> 00:15:50.240
him to death right there in the cell. And it's

211
00:15:50.240 --> 00:15:54.240
important to mention that Thomas he actually denies that he

212
00:15:54.320 --> 00:15:57.720
committed this murder all the way up to the day died. Now,

213
00:15:57.759 --> 00:16:00.240
I don't know, you know, obviously I wasn't. There have

214
00:16:00.320 --> 00:16:02.279
no direct knowledge. I don't know if he did or not.

215
00:16:02.879 --> 00:16:04.679
I know that he was tried for it, and I

216
00:16:04.720 --> 00:16:06.559
know he was convicted of it. But a part of

217
00:16:06.559 --> 00:16:10.279
me says, wow, this guy's not somebody who denies killing people.

218
00:16:10.399 --> 00:16:12.919
I mean, he admits to it when he kills you,

219
00:16:13.720 --> 00:16:17.559
and he denied this one. So you know, I don't

220
00:16:17.559 --> 00:16:19.840
know if there's any weight to that or all, but

221
00:16:20.000 --> 00:16:23.440
I don't know why he wouldn't accept the responsibility for

222
00:16:23.519 --> 00:16:26.240
that had he done it. So it's under some debate.

223
00:16:26.440 --> 00:16:29.600
But as I said, regardless, he gets charged with it.

224
00:16:30.360 --> 00:16:34.200
And while he's a waiting trial in that case, as

225
00:16:34.320 --> 00:16:37.759
luck would have it, the leader of the DC Blacks,

226
00:16:37.960 --> 00:16:42.120
a man by the name of Raymond Cadillac Smith, he

227
00:16:42.200 --> 00:16:48.679
gets transferred to Marion. Now, Silverstein would later claim that

228
00:16:48.799 --> 00:16:51.679
he tried to tell Cadillac Smith that he did not

229
00:16:51.840 --> 00:16:56.559
kill Chappelle and that Cadillac did not believe him, and

230
00:16:56.600 --> 00:17:00.000
it bragged to others that he was going to kill

231
00:17:00.159 --> 00:17:06.440
kill Silverstein. Now, this guy making that threat, you better

232
00:17:06.519 --> 00:17:09.400
take that serious. He was not just a member of

233
00:17:09.440 --> 00:17:14.160
the DC Blacks. He was the head shot caller, the

234
00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:17.000
leader of the gang. And the way he saw it,

235
00:17:17.559 --> 00:17:20.839
Silverstein killed one of his peeps, and he was going

236
00:17:20.920 --> 00:17:25.920
to get payback for that personally. Now, there are documents

237
00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:30.519
that say on at least two occasions Cadillac did attempt

238
00:17:30.519 --> 00:17:33.799
to get that payback that he seeked, but that those

239
00:17:34.039 --> 00:17:39.119
attempts failed. Well, Silverstein he sees the writing on the

240
00:17:39.160 --> 00:17:42.599
wall and he ascertains that he had to get Cadillac

241
00:17:42.720 --> 00:17:47.240
before Cadillac got him, right, So he hatches a plan

242
00:17:47.440 --> 00:17:50.759
with another inmate, an AB member by the name of

243
00:17:50.920 --> 00:17:56.480
Clayton Fountain, and they see that play through. So one night,

244
00:17:56.960 --> 00:18:01.359
in the shower of what's known as the Control Unit,

245
00:18:02.039 --> 00:18:07.480
they attack Cadillac. They use shanks and they stabbed Cadillac

246
00:18:08.039 --> 00:18:12.960
sixty seven times. And that wasn't all what they did

247
00:18:13.039 --> 00:18:19.240
after that even more shocking. After they kill Cadillac, they

248
00:18:19.359 --> 00:18:25.160
take his body and they drag it the entire length

249
00:18:25.599 --> 00:18:29.359
of the catwalk, the entire length of the tier, and

250
00:18:29.400 --> 00:18:34.039
they make sure to pass each inmates sell As they're

251
00:18:34.319 --> 00:18:38.240
dragging this guy who is now dead, this leader of

252
00:18:38.319 --> 00:18:43.680
the DC blacks down that tier and they pass all

253
00:18:43.720 --> 00:18:47.559
those cells in an effort to show the dominance of

254
00:18:47.640 --> 00:18:52.119
the AB. Now Silverstein, he admits to this martyr, but

255
00:18:52.240 --> 00:18:58.759
he framed it as a quote killer, be killed type situation. Regardless,

256
00:18:58.920 --> 00:19:03.400
he receives at another life sentence for that murder. So

257
00:19:03.519 --> 00:19:08.519
let's go into October second of nineteen eighty three, and

258
00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:13.160
a day that would pretty much change everything for prisons

259
00:19:13.799 --> 00:19:18.759
as we know them. Silverstein, still at Marion, was being

260
00:19:19.039 --> 00:19:23.440
escorted to the showers and he was handcuffed, and as

261
00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:27.160
he walked down the tier, another inmate by the name

262
00:19:27.200 --> 00:19:32.759
of Randy Gometz he passes Silverstein a shank through the

263
00:19:32.799 --> 00:19:37.440
bars of his cell, and while the escorts had to

264
00:19:37.480 --> 00:19:41.119
pause for whatever reason, for a second before continuing to

265
00:19:41.119 --> 00:19:45.519
go down that tier, somehow Gometz was able to use

266
00:19:45.559 --> 00:19:51.359
a headen key to unlock Silverstein's handcuffs without any of

267
00:19:51.400 --> 00:19:57.039
the correctional officers noticing. Silverstein then, in a fit of rage,

268
00:19:57.559 --> 00:20:04.359
turns on co Merle Klutz and he stabs Klutz forty

269
00:20:05.000 --> 00:20:10.759
times with that shank. Why well, Silverstein would later claim

270
00:20:11.039 --> 00:20:14.880
that Klutz would harass him a lot, and he would

271
00:20:14.880 --> 00:20:17.279
go in his cell and basically shake his cell down

272
00:20:17.319 --> 00:20:22.160
and just destroy his artwork. And apparently, Silverstein, the artwork

273
00:20:22.359 --> 00:20:26.279
was his thing. This was like his baby, and every

274
00:20:26.319 --> 00:20:28.880
time he would finish a project, Klutz would go in

275
00:20:28.920 --> 00:20:31.960
there and just destroy it. And he was pissed and

276
00:20:32.000 --> 00:20:34.400
that was, I guess, all the excuse he needed, so

277
00:20:34.480 --> 00:20:37.599
he stabbed him forty times and killed me. And what

278
00:20:37.720 --> 00:20:40.920
else is interesting is that on that same day, October

279
00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:44.759
two of nineteen eighty three, his old buddy Clayton Fountain.

280
00:20:45.359 --> 00:20:50.640
He kills another guard at that prison named Robert Hoffman,

281
00:20:50.839 --> 00:20:55.319
stabbing him twenty two times. And it was this incident

282
00:20:56.079 --> 00:21:00.480
that legend has in any way, this killing would directly

283
00:21:01.000 --> 00:21:05.359
lead to the supermax prisons as they are known as today,

284
00:21:05.839 --> 00:21:10.119
and all the safeguards, the way they're designed, all a

285
00:21:10.200 --> 00:21:17.119
reflection of this particular killing now marin itself. The prison

286
00:21:17.279 --> 00:21:22.559
it went through a twenty three year lockdown after this incident,

287
00:21:23.240 --> 00:21:26.880
and Silverstein, at this point he was labeled the most

288
00:21:27.160 --> 00:21:33.599
dangerous inmate in America with his third murder inside a prison.

289
00:21:34.279 --> 00:21:39.599
So post that murder, Silverstein gets transferred to what's known

290
00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:43.200
as United States Prison in Atlanta and he gets put

291
00:21:43.200 --> 00:21:47.240
in what's none as a side pocket cell. Now side

292
00:21:47.240 --> 00:21:53.000
pocket sell is basically timy steel boxes. That's basically what

293
00:21:53.079 --> 00:21:56.960
you're in. And they have like picture of the constant

294
00:21:57.240 --> 00:22:03.640
buzzing fluorescent lights. There's no clocks, no entertainment. The only

295
00:22:03.720 --> 00:22:07.200
book allowed in the cell is the Bible. I mean

296
00:22:07.240 --> 00:22:11.519
it's design where an inmate never knows what time it is,

297
00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:15.640
what day it is, and even how long the inmate

298
00:22:15.839 --> 00:22:18.519
may have slept. You wake up. You could have slept

299
00:22:18.519 --> 00:22:20.720
two hours, you could have slept ten hours. You'd have

300
00:22:20.759 --> 00:22:23.960
no freaking clue because you don't know whether it's daytime, nighttime,

301
00:22:24.359 --> 00:22:27.559
what time of day it is. Nothing. The goal is

302
00:22:27.599 --> 00:22:33.839
to totally disorient the inmate. Let's fast forward to nineteen

303
00:22:33.880 --> 00:22:37.960
eighty seven in the Atlanta prison rights. Now, the Atlanta

304
00:22:38.039 --> 00:22:42.279
Prison Rides were an eleven day uprising. This was at

305
00:22:42.359 --> 00:22:47.640
the US Penitentiary in Atlanta, where Silverstein was housed in Georgia,

306
00:22:48.079 --> 00:22:52.680
and it was the longest prison standoff in US history. Now,

307
00:22:52.720 --> 00:22:55.960
it was triggered because the US State Department had announced

308
00:22:56.000 --> 00:23:00.799
an agreement with Cuba to deport approximately twenty five hundred

309
00:23:01.000 --> 00:23:04.559
Cuban nationals to Cuba, and they held a riot. And

310
00:23:05.079 --> 00:23:08.039
there were actually riots all over the country, but the

311
00:23:08.119 --> 00:23:11.079
Atlanta prison riot was the worst. Well, it was during

312
00:23:11.200 --> 00:23:19.079
these riots that Silverstein actually gets released from that side

313
00:23:19.160 --> 00:23:24.119
pocket cell by other inmates, and he remained free within

314
00:23:24.240 --> 00:23:27.359
the prison for about a week before all of this

315
00:23:27.759 --> 00:23:31.319
got under control. A guard who was stuck in the

316
00:23:31.359 --> 00:23:35.519
prison actually had a run in with Silverstein while he

317
00:23:35.680 --> 00:23:39.599
was free within the walls, and by all accounts, Silverstein

318
00:23:39.680 --> 00:23:44.599
actually spared this guard's life because the guard treated him

319
00:23:44.720 --> 00:23:48.880
with some form of respect prior to the incident. Had

320
00:23:48.920 --> 00:23:52.920
he not done that, Silverstein likely would have killed him.

321
00:23:53.119 --> 00:23:58.160
So in those riots, eventually an FBI hostage rescue team

322
00:23:58.359 --> 00:24:03.359
comes in. Everything gets copaesthetic again, and then they round

323
00:24:03.440 --> 00:24:08.359
up Silverstein and they actually transfer him back to Levenworth

324
00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:14.240
where for the next eighteen years he stays locked up

325
00:24:14.759 --> 00:24:19.279
in solitary confinement. So Levenworth knew he was coming back

326
00:24:19.519 --> 00:24:22.200
and they had to prepare for that, and they actually

327
00:24:22.319 --> 00:24:26.839
construct a custom built cell for him. Not only do

328
00:24:26.960 --> 00:24:33.200
they construct one, they would name this cell Silverstein's Suite. Now,

329
00:24:33.279 --> 00:24:38.119
interactions with the staff were minimal. The delivery of his

330
00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:40.400
food is just like you would think you would see

331
00:24:40.440 --> 00:24:43.680
in a movie. Slight through the cell door, right, and

332
00:24:43.759 --> 00:24:46.920
they just passed the tray in. And his cell was

333
00:24:46.960 --> 00:24:50.680
about the size of a king sized mattress. His entire

334
00:24:50.759 --> 00:24:54.720
cell video surveillance in there twenty four hours a day,

335
00:24:54.799 --> 00:24:58.200
seven days a week. He was only allowed one phone

336
00:24:58.240 --> 00:25:02.319
call per month. In my opinion, he deserved every bit

337
00:25:02.359 --> 00:25:06.240
of it. So while Silverstein is living it up, if

338
00:25:06.240 --> 00:25:11.279
you will inside the Silverstein sweet his accomplice and buddy,

339
00:25:11.359 --> 00:25:15.160
remember Clayton Fountain. Well, he dies in two thousand and

340
00:25:15.200 --> 00:25:18.799
four in a federal prison in Missouri, and in two

341
00:25:18.880 --> 00:25:24.680
thousand and five another transfer for Silverstein when a brand

342
00:25:24.720 --> 00:25:31.240
new prison opens up called ADX Florence. This is in Colorado.

343
00:25:32.160 --> 00:25:37.400
It's known as the Alcatraz of the Rockies, and it

344
00:25:37.480 --> 00:25:42.759
is considered the world's most secure prison. Imperfect for Silverstein, right,

345
00:25:43.079 --> 00:25:47.880
practically built for him. So a little about ABX, and

346
00:25:47.960 --> 00:25:52.000
I did an episode several years ago on Bloody and

347
00:25:52.000 --> 00:25:55.799
Gola where I actually talked only about ABX Florence. Very

348
00:25:55.839 --> 00:26:01.680
interesting prison. It's designed for near total solitary confinement, and

349
00:26:01.720 --> 00:26:06.400
that's obviously to neutralize dangerous behavior. Only the worst of

350
00:26:06.480 --> 00:26:09.759
the worst in the world gets sent here. Uh, there's

351
00:26:09.799 --> 00:26:14.240
a lot of isolation. Inmates typically spend twenty three hours

352
00:26:14.279 --> 00:26:19.319
a day in a soundproof seven by twelve foot cell.

353
00:26:20.000 --> 00:26:22.559
So if you're somewhere where you can mark off seven

354
00:26:22.599 --> 00:26:26.359
feet by twelve feet, do it and imagine spending twenty

355
00:26:26.400 --> 00:26:29.519
three hours a day, seven days a week inside of

356
00:26:29.519 --> 00:26:31.839
that space for the rest of your life. That's what

357
00:26:32.519 --> 00:26:37.440
That's what ADX is. The cell features a bad a desk,

358
00:26:37.559 --> 00:26:40.240
it has a stool and all of that furniture is

359
00:26:40.319 --> 00:26:44.799
made of poured reinforced concrete, and that's to prevent people

360
00:26:44.839 --> 00:26:47.920
from making weapons. If you make, for example, a stool

361
00:26:47.960 --> 00:26:49.759
out of wood, what are they gonna do. They're gonna

362
00:26:49.759 --> 00:26:51.599
break one of the legs, sharpen it, and it's gonna

363
00:26:51.599 --> 00:26:54.640
be a pretty bad ass shank. Now, there's a limited

364
00:26:54.720 --> 00:26:56.759
view inside of that cell. As a matter of fact,

365
00:26:56.759 --> 00:26:59.039
some cells don't have any view at all, but some

366
00:26:59.279 --> 00:27:02.799
they have a window that's four inches wide and angled

367
00:27:03.200 --> 00:27:07.200
to only allow a view of the sky or the roof,

368
00:27:07.960 --> 00:27:11.519
and they do this because it prevents the inmates from

369
00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:16.920
knowing their exact location inside the complex. For recreation, the

370
00:27:17.079 --> 00:27:21.799
exercise occurs in what's known as a concrete pit. Imagine

371
00:27:21.839 --> 00:27:26.200
like an empty swimming pool, and you go in that

372
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:30.319
pit and you basically run in a circle for exercise.

373
00:27:30.440 --> 00:27:34.000
You get an hour a day, often while shackled, and

374
00:27:34.119 --> 00:27:38.559
that's that's that twenty fourth hour of the twenty three

375
00:27:38.559 --> 00:27:41.079
hours you're in your cell. That one hour is just

376
00:27:41.119 --> 00:27:44.599
for exercise, and you're usually shackled when you're out there.

377
00:27:44.960 --> 00:27:47.000
And if you're curious about some of the people that

378
00:27:47.039 --> 00:27:51.000
are housed there, well, they are the world's most notorious

379
00:27:51.039 --> 00:27:56.440
criminals that are behind bars. How about Joaquin El Chapo Guzman,

380
00:27:57.119 --> 00:28:01.559
the former leader of the Sinaloa car Hotel, He's house there.

381
00:28:01.960 --> 00:28:07.039
The Boston marathon bomber, he's housed there. How About a

382
00:28:07.200 --> 00:28:12.160
convicted nine to eleven conspirator Massali, he is house there.

383
00:28:12.960 --> 00:28:15.920
How About Richard Reid, who is also known as the

384
00:28:16.000 --> 00:28:21.640
shoe bomber, He's house there. Several members of ISIS are

385
00:28:21.720 --> 00:28:26.079
housed there. The perpetrator of the twenty seventeen New York

386
00:28:26.279 --> 00:28:30.400
City truck attack is housed there, and even gang members

387
00:28:30.440 --> 00:28:34.119
such as the founder of the Gangster Disciples, a guy

388
00:28:34.200 --> 00:28:39.599
by the name of Larry Hoover, housed at ADX Florence.

389
00:28:39.839 --> 00:28:42.680
So if you're curious how much time, because it just

390
00:28:43.119 --> 00:28:49.640
wasn't ADX Florence that Silverstein was housed at where he

391
00:28:49.720 --> 00:28:55.519
was in solitary confinement. But of his life, thirty six

392
00:28:55.599 --> 00:28:59.000
years of that was spent in some form of solitary.

393
00:28:59.079 --> 00:29:04.839
Now that's thirteen thousand, one hundred and forty days in

394
00:29:04.880 --> 00:29:10.200
a sell smaller than a parking space. Y'all, no human contact.

395
00:29:10.640 --> 00:29:15.079
And after he killed that correctional officer, guards out of

396
00:29:15.160 --> 00:29:19.039
respect for that correctional officer. None of them would speak

397
00:29:19.079 --> 00:29:23.119
to him at all, and that'll give you kind of

398
00:29:23.119 --> 00:29:27.200
an idea of what his life was like. So all

399
00:29:27.279 --> 00:29:32.759
this goes on and eventually Thomas Silverstein files a lawsuit

400
00:29:32.799 --> 00:29:36.720
with help from some students from the University of Denver.

401
00:29:36.759 --> 00:29:40.200
Now these students from the University of Denver, what are

402
00:29:40.200 --> 00:29:42.279
they trying to do. Well, they're trying to get a

403
00:29:42.359 --> 00:29:46.359
law degree. So everything they say take with a grain

404
00:29:46.440 --> 00:29:49.759
of salt. But I'm going to cover it in detail

405
00:29:49.920 --> 00:29:55.000
because really it really does break down the life of

406
00:29:55.039 --> 00:29:58.359
this guy. And he wrote it himself. It's called a

407
00:29:58.599 --> 00:30:04.440
Declaration of Thomas Silverstein. It was accepted into the United

408
00:30:04.480 --> 00:30:08.599
States District Court for the District of Colorado, and it

409
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:12.880
was Thomas Silverstein versus the Federal Bureau of Prisons. And

410
00:30:12.960 --> 00:30:17.920
it reads, I, Thomas Silverstein, declare, under penalty of perjury,

411
00:30:18.000 --> 00:30:20.880
that I had been held in solitary confinement for the

412
00:30:20.920 --> 00:30:24.640
past ten two hundred and twenty days, which is three

413
00:30:24.759 --> 00:30:28.000
hundred and thirty six moss or twenty eight years. I

414
00:30:28.039 --> 00:30:30.799
am fifty nine years old, and I have spent almost

415
00:30:30.839 --> 00:30:35.839
half my life in solitary confinement. Victim, right, he's a victim.

416
00:30:36.319 --> 00:30:40.200
The purpose of this declaration is to describe my experience

417
00:30:40.359 --> 00:30:44.000
during this lengthy period of solitary confinement, the nature and

418
00:30:44.079 --> 00:30:47.559
impact of the harsh conditions I have endured in spite

419
00:30:47.599 --> 00:30:51.599
of a spotless conduct record for over twenty two years. Now,

420
00:30:52.480 --> 00:30:54.359
I'm just going to interruptate there and say, you know,

421
00:30:54.519 --> 00:30:57.759
throw out the fact that I killed three people in

422
00:30:57.799 --> 00:31:01.359
prison in my lack of knowledge of about what, if anything,

423
00:31:01.400 --> 00:31:04.920
I can do less in my isolation. Nevertheless, I feel

424
00:31:04.960 --> 00:31:08.400
it would be disrespectful to say anything about my conditions

425
00:31:08.400 --> 00:31:12.240
of confinement without beginning with an apology for the actions

426
00:31:12.240 --> 00:31:15.079
that brought me here in the first place. An apology

427
00:31:15.160 --> 00:31:18.640
for the harm I have done is necessary before anything

428
00:31:18.680 --> 00:31:22.119
else can be said. Not a single one of the

429
00:31:22.319 --> 00:31:25.799
thousand days I have spent here has gone by where

430
00:31:25.839 --> 00:31:28.240
I have not regretted my actions that brought me here.

431
00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:30.519
Every day I think back in whish I had not

432
00:31:30.680 --> 00:31:34.119
killed Officer Klutz. I know that some people would continue

433
00:31:34.119 --> 00:31:36.079
to find this hard to believe, but I want it

434
00:31:36.119 --> 00:31:38.720
to be understood that this is not only because of

435
00:31:38.759 --> 00:31:41.440
my confinement that I feel this regret. I feel this

436
00:31:41.519 --> 00:31:43.839
way because I know what I did was wrong. I

437
00:31:43.880 --> 00:31:47.519
have become a person who recognizes and respects the value

438
00:31:47.680 --> 00:31:51.119
of the life of another people can and do change.

439
00:31:51.240 --> 00:31:53.880
I know I have, and I have become someone who

440
00:31:54.000 --> 00:31:57.880
is deeply sorry for having done such terrible harm to others.

441
00:31:58.359 --> 00:32:02.400
I saw the Klutz family at my sentencing hearing. Until

442
00:32:02.440 --> 00:32:05.039
that moment, I had never thought of Officer Klutz as

443
00:32:05.079 --> 00:32:07.599
having a family. As soon as I saw his children,

444
00:32:07.640 --> 00:32:11.559
I recognized I had hurt more people than just Officer Clutz.

445
00:32:11.920 --> 00:32:14.960
I wonder about his kids regularly and hope that they

446
00:32:14.960 --> 00:32:17.519
are okay and had been able to start families of

447
00:32:17.559 --> 00:32:21.440
their own. I have apologized publicly via my blog to

448
00:32:21.519 --> 00:32:25.119
Officer klutz children. I know his daughter saw my apology

449
00:32:25.200 --> 00:32:28.640
because she replied on the blog. Although I apologized, I

450
00:32:28.640 --> 00:32:31.359
would never presume to ask for their forgiveness, as what

451
00:32:31.440 --> 00:32:34.640
I did to them was unforgivable. I wish I could

452
00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:37.480
repair the damage that I have done to other people's lives.

453
00:32:37.519 --> 00:32:41.039
I also regret my actions because they harm my own children.

454
00:32:41.200 --> 00:32:44.680
They have suffered because their father was not there for them.

455
00:32:45.039 --> 00:32:48.720
There's almost nothing as difficult and as painful as knowing

456
00:32:48.799 --> 00:32:51.720
your children are suffering and knowing that you were the cause.

457
00:32:51.759 --> 00:32:54.359
And y'all, he did have children. Not a lot of

458
00:32:54.400 --> 00:32:58.279
information out there on that, but apparently he did. I

459
00:32:58.319 --> 00:33:01.480
feel guilty about this. Every when I feel pain for

460
00:33:01.559 --> 00:33:04.599
not having been there for my own children, I know

461
00:33:04.920 --> 00:33:08.200
that I also did this to Officer Clutch children. I

462
00:33:08.240 --> 00:33:11.680
am the reason they, like my own children, grew up

463
00:33:11.839 --> 00:33:14.279
without a father, and I'm sorry for that. When I

464
00:33:14.319 --> 00:33:16.240
look back on it now, it's hard for me to

465
00:33:16.359 --> 00:33:18.960
understand how I made the choices I did. There's no

466
00:33:19.279 --> 00:33:21.960
justification for my actions. I wish I could go back

467
00:33:22.000 --> 00:33:25.480
and stop myself, though I know this is impossible. I

468
00:33:25.559 --> 00:33:28.640
recognize the pain I have caused others, including my own

469
00:33:28.680 --> 00:33:31.359
family and children, and in response to that, I have

470
00:33:31.519 --> 00:33:34.960
worked to become a different man. Although I cannot repair

471
00:33:35.039 --> 00:33:38.839
the damage I caused. I am committed to nonviolence. It

472
00:33:38.960 --> 00:33:41.559
is a promise I have made myself, and one that

473
00:33:41.640 --> 00:33:44.920
I hope honors those I've hurt. It's a promise I

474
00:33:44.920 --> 00:33:48.799
have every intention of keeping. I understand that I do

475
00:33:48.880 --> 00:33:51.359
deserve to be punished for my actions, and I do

476
00:33:51.440 --> 00:33:54.960
not expect to ever be released from prison. My hope

477
00:33:55.000 --> 00:33:58.000
is simply to be allowed, like other prisoners, to earn

478
00:33:58.000 --> 00:34:02.119
the privileges that are warranted by my constant good conduct.

479
00:34:02.640 --> 00:34:04.599
I do not consider myself to be a part of

480
00:34:04.640 --> 00:34:07.000
any prison gang, nor do I want to be a

481
00:34:07.000 --> 00:34:08.960
part of any prison gang. I just want to serve

482
00:34:09.000 --> 00:34:12.400
out the remainder of my time peacefully with other mature

483
00:34:12.480 --> 00:34:16.320
guys doing their time. And then he goes into saying

484
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:19.000
the Bureau of Prisons has singled him out and treated

485
00:34:19.079 --> 00:34:22.719
him different. He says, although the Bureau of Prisons suggest

486
00:34:22.840 --> 00:34:25.599
I am irrational to think they are singling me out,

487
00:34:26.000 --> 00:34:28.880
I do not agree. I believe that this is what

488
00:34:28.920 --> 00:34:31.679
they have been doing, and I can understand why they

489
00:34:31.679 --> 00:34:34.400
would do it. I believe I had been treated worse

490
00:34:34.559 --> 00:34:37.800
than any prisoner in the Bureau of Prison. I read

491
00:34:37.880 --> 00:34:41.400
doctor Haney's report that I am the most isolated prisoner

492
00:34:41.679 --> 00:34:45.039
he has ever seen. It sometimes seems that the Bureau

493
00:34:45.039 --> 00:34:47.960
of Prisons is trying to test me, to provoke bad

494
00:34:48.000 --> 00:34:51.639
behaviors so they can justify their treatment of me. For example,

495
00:34:51.679 --> 00:34:54.800
when mentally ill people who scream all night or placed

496
00:34:54.800 --> 00:34:57.159
in my unit, it feels like the Bureau of Prisons

497
00:34:57.239 --> 00:35:00.719
is trying to see if they can make me break me.

498
00:35:01.280 --> 00:35:04.000
I tolerate the noise, though, because I don't want to

499
00:35:04.039 --> 00:35:06.199
break the rules I want to earn my way out

500
00:35:06.199 --> 00:35:09.400
of solitary. I also believe the Bureau of Prisons has

501
00:35:09.440 --> 00:35:13.480
purposely put known informants and sell some wreck areas around

502
00:35:13.519 --> 00:35:16.119
me in order to see if they can discover any

503
00:35:16.159 --> 00:35:20.039
negative information on me. But there's nothing to know, since

504
00:35:20.079 --> 00:35:23.320
I am simply trying to follow the rules. Since I

505
00:35:23.360 --> 00:35:26.360
have had clear conduct for decades, I don't know why

506
00:35:26.480 --> 00:35:30.239
we can continue to be held in isolation, except for

507
00:35:30.320 --> 00:35:34.079
the Bureau of Prisons desire to make me suffer for decades.

508
00:35:34.239 --> 00:35:36.920
Year after year, I've tried to demonstrate I am no

509
00:35:37.079 --> 00:35:40.599
longer the man I was in Marrion. It's important to

510
00:35:40.639 --> 00:35:45.360
note he's writing this inside of the supermacs at Colorado,

511
00:35:45.519 --> 00:35:48.760
right ADX. I've done and continue to do everything I

512
00:35:48.800 --> 00:35:51.519
can think of, all that the Bureau has asked me

513
00:35:51.599 --> 00:35:54.159
to do. I've showed I have changed and should be

514
00:35:54.199 --> 00:35:57.440
given relief from my isolation. I follow the rules. I'm

515
00:35:57.480 --> 00:36:00.719
respectful and polite. I watch the program they tell me

516
00:36:00.760 --> 00:36:03.320
to see. I've tried and every way I can think

517
00:36:03.360 --> 00:36:06.119
of to demonstrate I have no intentions to ever hurt

518
00:36:06.159 --> 00:36:09.320
anyone again. In addition to the efforts I have made,

519
00:36:09.360 --> 00:36:12.760
there is another reality I hope will be considered I'm

520
00:36:12.840 --> 00:36:15.880
quickly becoming an old man. I spend most of my

521
00:36:15.960 --> 00:36:19.480
days croche items for my family and my legal counsel

522
00:36:19.639 --> 00:36:23.599
in working on my artwork. And actually, y'all, he drew

523
00:36:23.880 --> 00:36:26.760
and he was a pretty good artist, believe it or not.

524
00:36:26.920 --> 00:36:29.679
It's hard to reconcile the Guara of Prison's description to

525
00:36:29.760 --> 00:36:32.840
me as frightening and scary when the people who see

526
00:36:32.920 --> 00:36:36.119
me here know I am a man peering through by vocals,

527
00:36:36.159 --> 00:36:39.119
trying to count the number of stitches to make an affghan.

528
00:36:39.800 --> 00:36:42.679
Although I think the way some officers have treated me

529
00:36:42.719 --> 00:36:46.079
as a violation of the rules, I understand why they

530
00:36:46.119 --> 00:36:48.519
act this way. I imagine it is a way for

531
00:36:48.599 --> 00:36:51.599
them to feel loyal to Officer Klutz. Even though it

532
00:36:51.639 --> 00:36:53.960
was very painful that no one would talk to me.

533
00:36:54.079 --> 00:36:56.840
I understand why people might act that way out of

534
00:36:56.880 --> 00:36:59.519
loyalty and also out of fear. I know that some

535
00:36:59.599 --> 00:37:02.719
people have suggested that my good behavior is a ruse,

536
00:37:03.039 --> 00:37:05.199
that I have been a model prisoner for twenty two

537
00:37:05.320 --> 00:37:08.199
years because I am waiting to have my restrictions lessons

538
00:37:08.239 --> 00:37:11.320
so I can lash out violently. They also say that

539
00:37:11.400 --> 00:37:14.280
I haven't acted out because I can't that my conditions

540
00:37:14.320 --> 00:37:17.599
are so restrictive there's nothing I can do. But this

541
00:37:17.760 --> 00:37:20.559
is just not true. I could have yelled at, or

542
00:37:20.639 --> 00:37:24.239
been disrespectful to, or even spit at the officers. I

543
00:37:24.280 --> 00:37:27.800
could have disobeyed an order or withheld my food trade

544
00:37:27.880 --> 00:37:31.880
and violated communication rules. I didn't, and I don't do

545
00:37:32.239 --> 00:37:35.480
any of these things. It's hard, if not impossible, for

546
00:37:35.559 --> 00:37:38.039
me to prove what is actually in my mind and

547
00:37:38.119 --> 00:37:40.880
what is not. All I can do is askaid others

548
00:37:40.960 --> 00:37:43.760
look at my current behavior and explain that it reflects

549
00:37:43.760 --> 00:37:48.320
my intention to never act violently again. Ever, I know

550
00:37:48.440 --> 00:37:52.719
the consequences, both to myself and others that will follow,

551
00:37:52.760 --> 00:37:55.320
and more importantly, I know that this is not who

552
00:37:55.360 --> 00:37:58.079
I want to be. My actions for the past twenty

553
00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:00.760
eight years are an expression of who I am and

554
00:38:00.840 --> 00:38:03.280
who I wish to be. When they took me from

555
00:38:03.400 --> 00:38:05.559
Levenworth and put me in a van to move me

556
00:38:05.639 --> 00:38:08.760
here to ABX, I thought I might finally be getting

557
00:38:08.840 --> 00:38:12.360
out of solitary confinement. Couldn't believe he said that I

558
00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:15.320
was over fifty years old. It had been incident free

559
00:38:15.440 --> 00:38:19.119
for lust twenty years. During the ride, I imagine myself

560
00:38:19.159 --> 00:38:22.079
having a job and being able to have contact visits

561
00:38:22.119 --> 00:38:25.440
with my family. Instead, I was placed in conditions that

562
00:38:25.519 --> 00:38:28.920
were worse than those at Levenworth. At that time, I

563
00:38:29.000 --> 00:38:33.599
lost hope of ever getting out of solitary confinement. This

564
00:38:33.760 --> 00:38:36.800
lawsuit has given me a little hope that my decades

565
00:38:36.840 --> 00:38:41.039
of clear conduct may be recognized. But even now I'm

566
00:38:41.039 --> 00:38:43.239
not hoping for much. I would like to be able

567
00:38:43.280 --> 00:38:46.039
to eat a meal with someone else occasionally. I would

568
00:38:46.119 --> 00:38:48.760
like to have a visit with my family that ends

569
00:38:48.840 --> 00:38:52.039
in being able to hug my daughter goodbye and to

570
00:38:52.079 --> 00:38:54.960
shake my son's hand. I know that I have sacrificed

571
00:38:55.039 --> 00:38:58.360
most of my rights by virtue of my actions as

572
00:38:58.360 --> 00:39:01.440
a much younger man. I think that these things are

573
00:39:01.559 --> 00:39:05.199
not too much to hope for, even in my circumstances.

574
00:39:05.239 --> 00:39:07.960
And then he gets into his version of his early years.

575
00:39:08.000 --> 00:39:10.960
He says I was born on February fourth of nineteen

576
00:39:11.039 --> 00:39:13.760
fifty two. Grew up in Long Beach, California, and my

577
00:39:13.840 --> 00:39:16.480
parents separated when I was very young, and I was

578
00:39:16.519 --> 00:39:20.519
adopted by my stepfather. My parents were middle class, but

579
00:39:20.559 --> 00:39:23.559
my home was an angry and violent place. It was

580
00:39:23.719 --> 00:39:26.400
not a safe place for a child or anyone else.

581
00:39:26.840 --> 00:39:30.760
My mother became verbally abusive and physically violent When she

582
00:39:30.920 --> 00:39:33.760
was angry. She lashed out at me often and would

583
00:39:33.840 --> 00:39:36.400
hit me with anything she had in her hands at

584
00:39:36.440 --> 00:39:39.159
the time, from a belt to a lamp to a

585
00:39:39.280 --> 00:39:43.039
rolling pin. Once she threw a kitchen knife at my head.

586
00:39:43.199 --> 00:39:45.400
Not only did she hit me and my sister, but

587
00:39:45.440 --> 00:39:48.440
my mom also would hit my stepfather when she was

588
00:39:48.480 --> 00:39:52.480
angry with him. There was constant physical aggression at my home.

589
00:39:52.559 --> 00:39:55.480
My mother's lesson was the only way to be strong

590
00:39:55.639 --> 00:39:59.119
was to be violent. She believed this. Once, after I

591
00:39:59.159 --> 00:40:01.599
was beaten up by another kid and I told you

592
00:40:01.639 --> 00:40:03.960
all about this, my mother told me, if I didn't

593
00:40:04.000 --> 00:40:06.880
stand up and fight for myself the next time this happened,

594
00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:09.599
she would take a belt to me herself. When I

595
00:40:09.639 --> 00:40:12.960
got home. I was miserable at home and also very

596
00:40:12.960 --> 00:40:17.119
confused and began to run away. Eventually, these runaways ended

597
00:40:17.199 --> 00:40:21.159
up with me being placed in juvenile offender centers. These

598
00:40:21.199 --> 00:40:23.920
two turned out to be dangerous places, full of people

599
00:40:23.960 --> 00:40:27.639
who harmed those that they thought were weaker than themselves.

600
00:40:28.119 --> 00:40:31.480
There I learned the single most important survival skill was

601
00:40:31.519 --> 00:40:34.199
to stand up for myself so that people didn't think

602
00:40:34.199 --> 00:40:36.760
I was weak. And prey upon me. By the time

603
00:40:36.800 --> 00:40:39.400
I was nineteen, I had landed in seeing Quentin on

604
00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:42.360
an arm robbery charge. When I was released on parole,

605
00:40:42.480 --> 00:40:45.280
I fell back into the same behavior. After that, I

606
00:40:45.320 --> 00:40:48.800
was arrested for robbery I committed with my biological father

607
00:40:48.920 --> 00:40:52.280
and my cousin, Gerald Hoff. I was twenty three when

608
00:40:52.320 --> 00:40:55.280
I was sentenced to fifteen years for that robbery. My

609
00:40:55.440 --> 00:40:58.639
share of those proceeds was a few hundred dollars. My

610
00:40:58.760 --> 00:41:02.800
life on the outside was over forever. When I interstand Quentin,

611
00:41:02.840 --> 00:41:07.119
the prison system was unstable and there were regular race rides. However,

612
00:41:07.400 --> 00:41:09.920
was not long before I finished my state time and

613
00:41:10.039 --> 00:41:14.719
was transferred to federal custody in USP at Leavenworth. Inside

614
00:41:14.719 --> 00:41:19.519
of Levenworth, the racial lines were strictly divided. Newcomers had

615
00:41:19.559 --> 00:41:22.360
to be careful not to show any weakness or word

616
00:41:22.400 --> 00:41:25.000
would get around that guys could take advantage of them.

617
00:41:25.519 --> 00:41:28.159
Because of the violence, I believe it was necessary to

618
00:41:28.199 --> 00:41:30.960
align myself with others for my own safety. And he's

619
00:41:31.000 --> 00:41:34.559
talking about the Arian brotherhood. In November of nineteen eighty,

620
00:41:34.599 --> 00:41:37.039
I was charged with and convicted of murder of a

621
00:41:37.079 --> 00:41:40.599
fellow inmate, Danny Atwell. I am innocent of this crime,

622
00:41:40.639 --> 00:41:44.480
and the conviction was subsequently reversed. And that's something I

623
00:41:44.519 --> 00:41:48.719
didn't tell y'all about, but it was reversed on some technicalities.

624
00:41:49.159 --> 00:41:52.840
Says at the evidentiary hearing before this case was reversed,

625
00:41:52.880 --> 00:41:56.519
the main witness against me, a prisoner who had benefited

626
00:41:56.519 --> 00:41:59.840
greatly from his testimony, admitted that I had lied and

627
00:42:00.079 --> 00:42:05.840
recanted his testimony. Unfortunately, this information only came out after

628
00:42:05.920 --> 00:42:09.480
I'd been transferred to the control unit at USB Marion.

629
00:42:09.880 --> 00:42:12.639
The control unit in any prison is the most punitive

630
00:42:12.719 --> 00:42:15.800
and restrictive part of the prison. This had special meaning

631
00:42:15.920 --> 00:42:19.599
in Marion, which was the highest security, most restrictive federal

632
00:42:19.639 --> 00:42:22.960
prison at that time. It was none among inmates that

633
00:42:23.039 --> 00:42:27.719
Marian was built to replace the old Alcatraz Penitentiary. Prisoners

634
00:42:27.719 --> 00:42:30.519
from across the country who were hard to house were

635
00:42:30.559 --> 00:42:32.440
sent there, and it soon became one of the most

636
00:42:32.519 --> 00:42:36.960
violent prisons in the system. Fights, riots, and assaults of

637
00:42:37.079 --> 00:42:42.559
prisoners and staff occurred regularly. This was a significant conflict

638
00:42:42.599 --> 00:42:46.000
between the staff and the prisoners At Marion. Even the

639
00:42:46.039 --> 00:42:50.119
control unit was extremely dangerous. Prisoners were armed with hominge

640
00:42:50.199 --> 00:42:53.760
knives or had access to obtaining weapons at all times.

641
00:42:54.159 --> 00:42:57.000
It's hard to explain how it felt to feel afraid

642
00:42:57.039 --> 00:43:00.360
that you could be killed essentially at any moment. In

643
00:43:00.440 --> 00:43:04.119
their individual cells, prisoners were not safe. I feared a

644
00:43:04.239 --> 00:43:07.280
tax on my life at all times from both prisoners

645
00:43:07.360 --> 00:43:10.559
and staff. The pressure to stand up for myself and

646
00:43:10.599 --> 00:43:14.199
not allow others to perceive me as weak was immense.

647
00:43:14.639 --> 00:43:18.199
Prisoners continue to be killed, even in the solitary and

648
00:43:18.320 --> 00:43:21.960
extreme conditions. In nineteen eighty two, I was convicted in

649
00:43:22.039 --> 00:43:25.159
the death of inmate Robert Chappelle, a murder I was

650
00:43:25.320 --> 00:43:29.159
not guilty of. I plead innocent and maintain my innocence

651
00:43:29.199 --> 00:43:32.000
to this day. I never knew Chappelle and had never

652
00:43:32.079 --> 00:43:35.039
even spoken to him, and I had no responsibility for

653
00:43:35.119 --> 00:43:37.679
his death. The fact that I was alleged to have

654
00:43:37.719 --> 00:43:42.320
been responsible, however, created an additional set of dangers for

655
00:43:42.440 --> 00:43:45.639
me at Marion. After the death of Chappelle, the Bureau

656
00:43:45.679 --> 00:43:50.360
of Prisons transferred inmate Robert Cadillac Smith to Marion. Though

657
00:43:50.400 --> 00:43:53.320
I had never before heard of Cadillac Smith, I learned

658
00:43:53.320 --> 00:43:56.800
that he had been friends with Chappelle. Soon after his arrival,

659
00:43:56.920 --> 00:43:59.760
Cadillac Smith began making it known that he planned to

660
00:43:59.800 --> 00:44:03.719
call me to avenge Chappelle's death. Despite these threats, the

661
00:44:03.760 --> 00:44:07.480
Bureau of Prisons house Cadillac Smith with the three cells

662
00:44:07.480 --> 00:44:10.800
of me at Marion. Since I hadn't killed Chappelle. I

663
00:44:10.840 --> 00:44:14.280
had nothing against Cadillac Smith prior to his arrival, but

664
00:44:14.360 --> 00:44:18.159
I became very apprehensive about him once those threats began.

665
00:44:18.719 --> 00:44:21.440
I'm aware of the Bureau of Prison now claims Cadillac

666
00:44:21.519 --> 00:44:24.679
Smith was the leader of the DC Gang, but at

667
00:44:24.719 --> 00:44:27.360
the time I did not know of this or even

668
00:44:27.519 --> 00:44:30.960
hear of a gang called the DC Blacks. I only

669
00:44:31.039 --> 00:44:34.440
learned that the Bureau of Prisons claimed that Cadillac Smith

670
00:44:34.559 --> 00:44:37.239
was a leader of the DC Blacks when I read

671
00:44:37.360 --> 00:44:41.039
Pete Early's book About ten years after I was housed

672
00:44:41.039 --> 00:44:44.239
in Marion. Cadillac Smith attempted to kill me on two

673
00:44:44.320 --> 00:44:47.760
separate occasions between December of nineteen eighty one and September

674
00:44:47.800 --> 00:44:50.920
of nineteen eighty two, once with a homemade zip gun

675
00:44:51.039 --> 00:44:54.880
that thankfully failed to fire, in a second time with

676
00:44:55.000 --> 00:44:58.440
a knife. Even though Bureau of Prison officials were aware

677
00:44:58.480 --> 00:45:00.679
of his attempt to take my life and put him

678
00:45:00.679 --> 00:45:03.400
into the hole because of it, the Bureau of Prisons

679
00:45:03.480 --> 00:45:06.400
later returned him to my same unit and didn't take

680
00:45:06.519 --> 00:45:10.280
any action to make me safe. When he returned, Cadillac

681
00:45:10.320 --> 00:45:12.920
Smith continued to tell me and others that he was

682
00:45:12.960 --> 00:45:16.519
going to kill me. Believing that Cadillac Smith would not

683
00:45:16.679 --> 00:45:20.199
stop until succeeding in killing me, and seeing the Bureau

684
00:45:20.239 --> 00:45:22.760
of Prisons was not going to take any measures to

685
00:45:22.840 --> 00:45:26.599
help protect me, I killed Cadillac Smith on September twenty

686
00:45:26.599 --> 00:45:29.960
seventh of nineteen eighty two. Although at the time I

687
00:45:29.960 --> 00:45:33.639
believed I was acting in self defense. I deeply regret

688
00:45:33.679 --> 00:45:35.880
my actions. I am sorry for the pain I have

689
00:45:36.000 --> 00:45:39.480
caused the Smith family. After I killed Smith, I lived

690
00:45:39.519 --> 00:45:43.199
in constant fear of reprisals. It was in this state

691
00:45:43.239 --> 00:45:45.880
of mind and believing I was in a life threatening

692
00:45:45.960 --> 00:45:49.719
situation that on October twenty second of nineteen eighty three,

693
00:45:49.840 --> 00:45:53.480
I killed Officer Klutz. I regret my actions, and I'm

694
00:45:53.519 --> 00:45:56.760
sorry for the death of Officer Klutz. I'm also sorry

695
00:45:56.840 --> 00:45:59.400
for the pain I have caused a Klutz family. Even

696
00:45:59.440 --> 00:46:02.800
writing the declaration, I feel my words of regret or

697
00:46:02.840 --> 00:46:06.480
inadequate to explain the remorse I feel and how much

698
00:46:06.559 --> 00:46:10.480
I am sorry for this action. And that is where

699
00:46:10.639 --> 00:46:14.000
I am going to cut it off. For today, but

700
00:46:14.119 --> 00:46:18.039
we got a lot more to cover. We've got this guy,

701
00:46:18.199 --> 00:46:22.719
the most dangerous prisoner in US history in some people's opinion,

702
00:46:23.039 --> 00:46:27.039
Thomas Silverstein, terrible Tommy. We've got the rest of his

703
00:46:27.119 --> 00:46:29.880
story in his own words that I'm going to bring

704
00:46:29.960 --> 00:46:34.239
you on the next episode of Bloody Inngola. Trust me,

705
00:46:34.440 --> 00:46:37.039
it gets wild from here. As a matter of fact,

706
00:46:37.159 --> 00:46:39.039
the next subject we're going to talk about is a

707
00:46:39.239 --> 00:46:43.679
side pocketsel that I mentioned in today's episode. So thank

708
00:46:43.719 --> 00:46:46.840
you so much for listening. Check out the Patreon Patreon

709
00:46:46.920 --> 00:46:51.039
dot com slash Bloody Angola podcast for commercial, free early

710
00:46:51.079 --> 00:46:55.280
release episodes and mores And until next time for Bloody Inngola,

711
00:46:55.639 --> 00:46:58.320
a podcast one hundred and forty two years in the making,

712
00:46:58.440 --> 00:47:02.639
the complete story of America. It's Bloody's present peace.

713
00:47:18.320 --> 00:47:28.800
I Wall Street, line, shackle, chain, Oh gesome, girdie, it's

714
00:47:28.920 --> 00:47:35.320
calling my name. There is no mercy, and it's been

715
00:47:35.480 --> 00:47:43.920
a century. Juice as the hill stream game, wrangled of three.

716
00:47:45.440 --> 00:47:50.599
Come here behind by me to die.

717
00:47:52.239 --> 00:47:59.519
Inside these walls, inside the wild, And when

718
00:48:00.519 --> 00:48:17.199
Gods I'm know it's abody Angler, ohbody angle,