Buried Alive: The Incarceration of Tiffany Cole

0:15 A wall street line, shackle change, Oh weesome, gird, it's calling my name. There is no mercy and it's been a tentery juice as the huge stream game Rango three, come here by. Me to die. Inside these walls, inside the wild, hadn't went the girl as I.

1:30 Hey everyone, and welcome back to Bloody and Gola, a podcast one and forty two years in the making, the complete story of America's bloodiest prison. I'm Jim Chapman. And look, last week I brought you the story of what many consider the most dangerous male prisoner ever in the history of prisons in the United States, and that was the story of Thomas Silverstein, otherwise known as Terrible Tommy. So after I finished up that story, it got me curious on who would be considered the most dangerous female prisoner in the United States. But I wanted to cover someone that was still alive and still incarcerated in prison, and one stood out.

2:17 To me more than others in my research, and. That was an inmate currently incarcerated in Florida for the murder of an elderly couple after kidnapping and robbing them. And so today I'm going to tell you the story of Tiffany Coal. And she had some co conspirators that I'm going to touch on as well, but the majority of this all about her. So in order to tell you why Tiffany Cole ended up where she ended up, we have to start at the beginning and her upbringing, her background, if you will. And as is common with a lot of people that end up where Tiffany Cole ends up, it usually starts with a traumatic childhood. Not all cases, but a lot of cases that I see, and this story will be no different. So Tiffany Cole, she was born on December third of nineteen eighty one in Charleston, South Carolina. And Charleston, South Carolina, y'all, a very historic coastal city known for its cobblestone streets, its Southern charm, and historically speaking, it was a major port back in the day, featuring Antebelle homes, plantations, and significant.

3:34 Civil War sites. Fort Sumterter, for example, is in Charleston, South Carolina. There are a lot of beautiful beaches there, they have great food, just an amazing place to live and visit. As a matter of fact, Charleston attracts millions of visitors each year to its downtown area and as beautiful as Charleston, South Carolina is where Tiffany Cole grew up. Unfortunately, her family life was a stark contrast to that beauty, and from the beginning her life was difficult. Her mother, Shirley Duncan, was sixteen years old when she had Tiffany. She was unweeded at the time, and the father was a guy named David Duncan Senior, and he was in prison at the time of her birth, So you can imagine the amount of instability that comes with that. Now, Initially, she would live with her mother and her maternal grandmother, and the family would frequently move to different areas of Charleston, South Carolina, and they would rely heavily on government assistance.

4:48 They just never had any money. Man, they were struggling. Now, sometime in the early nineteen eighties, during her toddler years, her parents would eventually marry. After her father got out of prison. He would provide some financial support, but it was strictly financial. He showed very little emotional interest in his daughter, according to Tiffany, So with all of this turmoil. It wasn't long. As a matter of fact, it was nineteen eighty six, when Tiffany was just five years old, that her parents would divorce, and, as is common in a lot of divorces, she's going to be shuttled back and forth between her father and her mother, and you know a lot of instability with that. He was also around this time that her brother, dj was born, and things were so unstable in their households that she would become kind of like a surrogate mother to her younger brother due to all this instability, even at the young age of five. Now, in the late nineteen eighties and early nineteen nineties, during her childhood, the environment would get even more turbulent for Tiffany.

6:09 She would witness physical abuse toward family members, including her brother getting physically beat by her stepfather allegedly, and she would even describe an incident later on in life where her stepfather broke a puppy's neck by throwing it against the wall, and she would characterize that as a time in her life where that was extremely traumatic because she had such an affection toward animals like a lot of us do now. It was during this time that her family lived next door to a couple, and the couple's name were Carol and Reggie Sumner and her father would become friends with this couple, being that they were next door neighbors. Right now, this couple, of course, is going to come into play heavily, very heavily later on in this podcast, but for now, moving on in Tiffany's life.

7:09 In nineteen eighty three, at the age of twelve, her mother gets in a relationship with a man and his name is Rick, and Rick would become Tiffany's stepfather and this would lead to the birth of a younger brother. Now, it was at this time that twelve year old Tiffany would also hit a pretty tough time in her life. She would start running away from home and would really spiral into just a awful world of substance abuse with some hard drugs. I'm not talking marijuana, hear, I'm talking cocaine xanax. And she would also start drinking heavily, and it blows my mind. Twelve years old. How the fuck do you get cocaine at twelve years old? I have no idea, but Tiffany figured it out.

8:00 How do you drink heavily at twelve? I understand if you sneak into your mom's kitchen cabinet or something and steal alcohol, but drinking to her extent. Now. Surprisingly also during this time, she still managed to stay in school and she actually had really good grades and would participate in a lot of extracurricular activities like band and girl Scouts. But in the tenth grade, she dropped out of school and she runs away from her mother's home permanently and she moves in with her first boyfriend, Steven.

8:41 Now she was sixteen at this time in her life, and that relationship would last for about two years, but she would be abused often by this guy, and later she would say he completely destroyed her self esteem, along with another incident that would occur at just the young age of sixteen, when her father, David Duncan, allegedly would start sexually abusing his own daughter. For a period of the next two years. So around nineteen ninety nine, she is I'm as eighteen years old and she confides in her mother about this sex abuse that was taking place at the hands of her father, and this is all Tiffany alleging this, and later she would say her mother did not believe her and basically accused her of lying about all of this, and she really didn't know what to do at that point, but at the age of eighteen, Tiffany Cole would move on.

9:48 She would actually earn her ged work several jobs at that time in her life, including being a waitress, a cashier, She was an administrative assistant a woman's health clinic. I mean, she was trying. And it was also at this point in time, the year two thousand, that Tiffany would meet and start exclusively dating a guy by the name of Wayne, and Wayne was the son. Of a sheriff. Now, Wayne, much like her prior relationship choices, very violent. God. There were allegedly situations where he would hit her with an axe handle, he would break her car windshield. I mean, according to her, this dude was violent. She also became a mother between the ages of eighteen and twenty three. Now, the details of her daughter very limited. Not much as known about who the father is or the exact year birth of the child, and it's really not important to this story. It's only important to know that she did have a child. The big details on that not as important.

10:59 And I would imagine Jennet, that's to protect the daughter. And so that's why there's just not much out there now at the age of twenty three, in early two thousand and five, Tiffany learns that her father had terminal cancer, and she moves into his home to take care of him. And when I read that aspect of this case kind of surprised me. She must have some sort of heart there, at least for her father, because the same guy that was molesting her for years and she still moved into his home to take care of him when he had terminal cancer. But it brings up the next part of this story, and the most important part of this story.

11:40 So if you remember in the beginning of this one, I told you about a couple that were her neighbors, Carol and Reggie Sumner. I mentioned him earlier. Well, they always maintained touch with Tiffany and her father, but in the summer of two thousand and five, they decide to move to Jacksonville, Florida. Both had become ill. Reggie had inmphysema and several other problems. He could barely walk. At this point. They were sixty one years old, both of them. His wife Carol at the time, had lever cancer stemming from hepatitis sea. So they tell Tiffany about this move, and Tiffany says, what are you going to do?

12:23 You know you've got two cars. I guess they only needed one. What are you going to do with that green Chevy Lumina. And rather than Tiffany paying cash because she was interested in buying it, they knew she didn't have much cash. They agreed. They said, look, here's what we'll do. If you want to buy our green Chevy Lumina, will charge you a certain amount per month. They'll basically self finance it to her, and you can either mail us some money or you can come see us, come visit us, and pay us at that time. And she agrees to do that. Everybody's happy now out Jacksonville, although it's in a completely different state than Charleston, South Carolina, tell me about three and a half hours away. So Tiffany, who they really cared about, she could visit them to make those payments if she wanted to, and she would make several trips their way. This couple really looked at Tiffany as their own granddaughter, really cared for her. They knew she had a tough life and they wanted to help her.

13:29 So let's get into a little bit of who the Sumners were, and I think it explains why they kind of took a liking to Tiffany, especially in the case of Carol Sumner. So Carolyn Reggie, they originally met each other in high school. This was in the late nineteen fifties, and they began dating in high school. But after high school, for whatever reason, after graduation, they break up and it would not be until much later in life they reconnect. They would fall in love and they would get married. Now in the meantime, Reggie Sumner would join the Navy, then he will work for the railroad. He would get married and then divorced. And Carol would also have two prior marriages which would lead to the birth of two children.

14:21 But her marriages were difficult. The first one ended in divorce. The second one was extremely abusive, so abusive in fact, that Carol would file a restraining order just to have the second husband show up at her house and. Shoot her six times. Police would chase him down, they would corner him, and then he would shoot himself. He would die. Carol, however, would survive. And I think that's why she had kind of a ken ship with this young girl Tiffany, was because maybe she kind of felt like that was her at one point in her life. So after all of that went down, so many years would pass before Carol and Reggie would meet again. And at that point, Reggie worked for a telephone company. You got to hear how they kind of got reconnected. Literally, he worked for a telephone company and he got a call from Carol about telephone, sir, she was having some issues. She's calling the telephone company and saying, something's wrong my phone right, And he says, what's your name? She says her name, and he's.

15:34 Like, oh, I know you. We used to date. That total chance encounter would cause them to rekindle their relationship, and a year after that this couple would get married. So life goes. On, and as I told you, they end up moving to Florida, Jacksonville, and that's where we're gonna pick up and Tiffany, she gets involved in a relationship with a guy in his name is Michael James Jackson. You can't make that shit up. Michael Jackson, whose name was Michael Jackson. Michael Jackson was not a good guy at all. This dude had a long history of felonies throughout his life and was actually just released on parole when he and Tiffany met, and this was on May fourteenth of two thousand and five, and it was in a hotel lobby in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina, where Tiffany had traveled there with two friends. They were gonna have fun hangout. She meets this guy in the lobby, Michael Jackson, and they fall in love right in one day. So keep that in mind, and we're gonna fast forward a bit to July of two thousand and five and one of Carol's daughters, Ronda, she gets concerned because she hadn't heard from her mother and her stepfather in almost a week. Now, they typically talk every day, so this was very out of the norm for them. She's so concerned, in fact, that she

17:05 makes a three hour drive from Charleston to Jacksonville to check on them. When she pulled up to the house the couples know where to be seen, she can't find them anywhere. She's looking in windows, doing the whole deal. She doesn't see them anywhere. So on July tenth, she calls the Jacksonville Police Department and she reports them missing. So police they go make a welfare check and they note several things when they arrived. First of all, they noticed the Sumner's car was missing. They also noticed the door was unlocked. Now did her daughter check the door. I couldn't find whether she did or not. Hopefully she did.

17:47 Maybe she went inside and noticed they weren't inside either, But it never mentioned that, so I didn't want to say it. But the police did notice the door was unlocked, food was left on the stove, Carol's phone was left connected to her charger. Her cell phone, and a planner that Carol would always keep with her in the matter where she went. That was also in the house, which was very strange. Some other things say that is the family dog was still there. And even all the medication that Carol and her husband, Reggie needed were in the house. They didn't take it with them. So this told police right off.

18:31 They didn't go on some sort of vacation and not just tell anybody they were missing. And it was under suspicious circumstances, because you're not going to leave your medicine, you're not going to leave your planner, you're not going to leave your dog and just split down. So at this point detectives started investigating. They put out a bolo A be on the lookout for the vehicle, and they also gather some pictures of the couple together, working with the couple's daughter, Ronda, who reported all of this, and they issue that to the media and they say, cover this on all the news. They're very concerned about this couple.

19:12 And it was not long before they get a tip about the car when they release a picture of the car and it's found nearly fifty miles from Jacksonville. And the car was unlocked, but it didn't have any keys in it. So as they're working that scene, just five hours after finding the car, the police get a really strange phone call. Listen to this thigs ready, I'm to tell them my wife right and assistant passed away from the Mars division. The neighborhood called this morning and said open that. The Lincoln was missing.

19:52 We just moved actually too there, not long ago from South Carolina. Do you have anybody that we can contact to help us make sure that everything of the house should be there? Oh? Now, this person identified themselves as you just heard as Reggie Sumner. But did you hear that voice? Did that sound like a sixty one year old man to you? Well, that's the same reaction the police had. He also said they were having a tough time using their bank cards. Police ask him, hey, can we speak to Carol? And that's when the female voice gets on the phone. And obviously that wasn't the voice of a sixty one year old female who is very sick. Not dealing with the sharpest knives in the deck here are we. So police they start investigating where that call came from, who was that line tied to, what cell phone number did that come from, those sorts of things. And they also start looking into the banking records for those bank cards because the caller did note in that conversation that they couldn't get the bank cards to work. Just idiots, right, So when police started investigating the banking situation here, they pull statements and they notice a bunch of ATM withdrawals in and around the time that this couple went missing. And when you get to an ATM, what happens every time

21:23 you go, well, you get caught on camera. So when police look at the camera footage, they get the faces of those tied to the voices that they heard in the phone calls. They were also able to trace the cell phone number as well that it called the police department. And when they pull the cell phone records, they see a call to a car rental company, So they call the car rental company, which in turn was able to cross reference the cell number the police provided to the person that rented a car in that car was a silver Mazda RX eight, and police knew that that's the same car that was pulling up at these ATMs with people getting out of it. And those two voices police heard on the phone call claiming to be the missing couple, well obviously those were none other than the voices of Tiffany Cole and Michael Jackson. Police would also discover, now, as luck would have it, the Mazda was equipped with GPS.

22:34 The rental car and with the help of the rental car company, the police would trace that car to a motel in South Carolina, and at that motel they find two rooms rented out in Tiffany Call's real name. Now, in those two rooms, one room contained Tiffany and Michael Jackson and the other room was an eighteen year old man by the name of Alan Wade. What do you think police did at that point, Well, they go pull those people out of the rooms. They take them to the police station and they start questioning them, and what they would get out of them when the smoke cleared was absolutely horrific. Now, early in the questioning, another name is going to surface, and it was a guy by the name of Bruce Nixon, and he was pretty much the key to this case because Bruce Nixon would sing like a freaking canary on this whole deal, in all the horrific details that are involved, and as Bruce Nixon would tell it, Michael and Tiffany traveled to Jacksonville to visit the third guy that was in that hotel room, Alan Wade. He lived in Jacksonville, so they travel to go see him, and on the way they stop off at the Sumner's house and the summoner says, Hey, since you're going to be down here visiting your friend, if y'all want to stay here instead of getting a hotel room,

24:05 we're cool with it. That's fine. So Tiffany and Michael agree to do that and they go visit their friend. They come back to the couple's home and while they're there at night, I would assume all sitting around the kitchen table, the Sumners mentioned that they recently finally sold their house in South Carolina, and that they got a good profit off of this house. Mister Sumner Reggie, he was proud of this. He says, Man, we profited like ninety thousand dollars on that house. Well, when you tell. That to someone like me, I'm gonna say, man, that's great, and it's going to be in one ear and out the other. But when you tell that to a piece of shit like Michael Jackson, who is nothing but a career criminal, right, he hears this, and when you have a criminal mind, that's going to raise a radar. And he starts taking mental notes of that and everything else as it relates to that house. He starts looking around at the furnishings. In his mind, he's adding up how much money he could get by stealing this stuff. Right, So he gets Tiffany by herself at some point and they hatch a plan. And initially that plan was, hey, we can break in when they're not here, but for some reason he decides against doing that. And then the plan becomes we can just give them an overabundance of their medicine and kill them.

25:34 But for whatever reason. He decided against that and then they evolve that plan into another plan. And this is where Michael initiates the help of Bruce Nixon, and he said, Hey, Bruce, I want to rob someone's house. And I'm not sure exactly what he told Bruce Nixon as far as what the plan was from there. Now, if you listen to Bruce Nixon, Bruce Nixon says, they went and got shovels, but he was under the understanding that they were going to bury the stuff that they stole from this couple for a while and then go back and get it. We'll go with his story for now. The trio they do. They get some shovels, Michael, Bruce Nixon, and Tiffany Cole and they go to a remote wooded area in Georgia and they dig a hole. And this hole is six feet deep by four feet wide six feet deep by four feet wide. Now, Allen and Bruce and Michael dug the hole and Tiffany she holds the flashlight. So on July eighth of two thousand and five, around ten o'clock PM, they rent this Mazda and they drive to the couple's home and they have a fake gun in toe. They didn't want a record of purchasing a gun, so they actually got a toy gun. And while Tiffany and Michael wait inside the car, Alan and Bruce got.

27:06 To the door of this couple. Because the couple knew who Tiffany and Mike were, right, they didn't know who Alan and Bruce were. So Carol goes to the door and these two total strangers to her. They say, we're having car trouble. And Carol, who had never seen these guys before, but that's just who she was, she wanted to help. She lets them in to use the find so as Sennys ain't enter, they pull out the fake gun and they pointed at that couple and the Sumners. They're scared shitless. I mean, miss Sumner very bad health, poor lady sixty one years old. She was in that position to fight them. She's just scared shitless.

27:52 Her husband can barely walk. As a matter of fact, he was needing to be wheeled around in a wheelchair in most places. Of that, both of them very ill. And these guys pull a gun pointed at him and they start pleading for their life. And they say, hey, look, we'll cooperate with whatever you want us to do you can have whatever you want, just don't kill us. But all that pleading just basically falls on deaf ears the men. At that point, they pull out duct tape and they tape the couple's eyes, They tape their hands, they tape their feet, and they tape their mouth and can you imagine how scared they are. Alan then goes and cuts the phone lines, and at that point Michael comes into the home and he starts taking the financial records that he made a mental note of where these were located.

28:45 He also steals the couple's valuable coin collection from the home. They then take this elderly couple and they force them into the trunk of their own car and they the couple with Michael and Tiffany in one vehicle and these other two assholes in the vehicle that belonged to Carolyn Reggie. They drive that to that pre dug hole. And Michael would say this later, which is just heartbreaking to me. So apparently on the ride the couple inside of that trunk, they managed to break free of the duct tape and they untape themselves. They untape their eyes, they untape their mouth, etc.

29:33 Now nobody in. The car do that outside of the couple. But when they get to where they're going, they get to that hole, they get at the back, they pop the trunk and Michael's standing there and the couple is just lying there in the trunk, embracing each other and praying, absolutely scared to death. Now U Paun seeing this, Michael in a total piece of shit move, tells them you're gonna have to put the duct tape on, and you're gonna have to put it back over your eyes because I don't want to see your eyes when I shoot. You wrap your mind around that. So then he forces them out of the car and somehow he manages to get their ATM PEN number.

30:21 I'm sure it didn't take much. Prime they're scared absolutely to death, and they give up that PEN number and he takes them at that point and he shoves them into this pre dug hole. Now remember that gun is fake. He can't shoot him to death first. He just simply shoves them into the hole and covers it up, bearing them alive. Now, later autopsies would show that both Reggie and Carol had dirt in their lungs, meaning they were completely buried alive, and they were sucking in dirt when they would breathe horrible. The group then dumped the vehicle and they go on a week long fucking party with the victim's money, complete with limousines, champagne, drugs, orgies, you name it. So, with all this information, they indict everybody on August eighteenth of two thousand and five in Duval County, Florida on charges of two counts each of first degree murder, arm, robbery, and kidnapping. Now, the trials were held separately, and Bruce Nixon, he obviously was the one that cooperated with authorities, so he got a plea deal in his case, and on March twelfth of two thousand and seven, he pleaded guilty to two counts of

31:53 second degree murder, two counts of kidnapping, and some other charges related to the case. But in exchange for his cooperation and testimony against the others that were accused, and that was important, he did avoid the death penalty. And he was also the one to lead police to the victim's grave site, which I've often said this, I'm okay with plea deals if they lead to something like that. So he was sentenced to two concurrent forty five year prison tern, which means they're at the same time. It's not ninety years, it's forty five years essentially for both as a total. Michael Jackson was up next. This was in May of two thousand and seven, and he was convicted after a separate trial of two counts of first degree murder and he was sentenced to two death penalties, one for each murder. On October twentieth of two thousand and seven, Tiffany Cole was convicted. That was after a week long trial. This was in Duval County, Florida, of two accounts of first degree murder, two counts of kidnapping, in two counts ounce of robbery. Now, the jury deliberated for less than ninety minutes and they end up voting nine to three in favor of the death penalty, so she does. She gets the death penalty in that case on October twenty fourth of two thousand and seven. Just a few days later, Alan Wade is convicted after a separate trial of two counts of first three murder, two

33:25 counts of armed robbery, in two counts of kidnapping, and in his penalty phase. On November fifteenth of two thousand and seven, the jury recommends a death sentence by eleven to one vote, so he also gets the death penalty. So at this point, everybody is sentenced to death, with the exception of the guy that cooperated. But a law surfaces in twenty sixteen that changes everything. And that law in twenty sixteen required a unanimous jury verdict in a death penalty case for you to actually get the death penalty.

34:06 So what happens They all have to get retried again. And I'll just. Skip the dates of when all of this occurred, but it was between twenty twenty two and twenty twenty five. But Alan Wade ends up being resentenced to life in prison. Michael Jackson also gets resentenced to life in prison. Tiffany Cole also resentenced to life in prison. However, that and I know this is hard to get boom and I know this is hard to keep up with, but the law goes back in twenty twenty four. I believe it was to where you can be sentenced with a non unanimous jury, and Michael Jackson's resentenced to death in his case.

35:00 So that's what happened to all four of those individuals. When all the smoke cleared, Michael Jackson was the only one to receive the death penalty. Everyone else got resentenced to life in prison, and as of this recording in January of twenty twenty six, Tiffany is now forty four years old and she's serving life at Lowell Correctional Institute in Florida. And at her resentencing relatives of Sumners, they express their forgiveness of Tiffany, saying quote, I truly forgive you, and all I can say is that is a better person than me. And I'll say that straight up because I could never forgive someone who buried a friend of mine a life, much less a family member. And I got something for you that I'm going to play for you, just to close this one out, because there's some people out there that are going to want to hear this.

36:01 And this is actually the questioning of Michael Jackson. Because you want to talk to me without your attorney, Yeah, because I know, I mean, you got to go through all kind of craziness to get the blow in. It takes you long ago. But now before we do that, you know you don't have to speak to me, right, yeah, of course, and you know that you're waving You're right to have your attorney by talking with me. Right, We've gone over your rights multiple multiple, multiple times. Do you have any questions about those? Okay, just want to make sure that's clear before we get going here. I'm wanting to hear what I'm gonna leave those at. The more. So, what you wanna talk about today?

36:42 Maybe last time I went to court from I mean, I don't really know what's going on because, like I said, I ain't got to discovery yet. I really know you know what's having When the last time went to court, he put in the motion for the bond or whatever, and it Jelly says something about him to the Home State. He said something about it to say that you got a father AffA David or something about if evidence is evidence. I don't you know what I'm saying. What do you want to bond hearing? Yeah, that's what I'm trying to get happy capital murder case in Florida. There is no bond. Ain't gonna happen. Don't understand them. It's the rules. No bond. First degree murder. You've been indicted by the grand jury on charges of first degree murder. There is no bond on the first degree murder charge. No possibility of getting out, no possibility of bond whatsoever. Well sums that up quick pretty much.

37:31 That question. Don Yeah, I'll be straight up with you. I've been straight with you from the get go. I gonna lie to you. Michael. Let me ask you a question. If you got to bond, hearing you can show back up in court. Yeah, no, no, no, it's just like I told lawyer. It's just like I told my lawyer. My parents said they would come down here and give me an apartment down here, everything just so I don't go nowhere, so I can no offense. You're getting freak housing. If I was in your position, Let's be honest. If I was in your position, I damn sure wouldn't show back up. Man, can all this? I can prove what I can prove. A lot of stuff I can beve. Then I ain't kill nobody do that because I can. I can do that. Improve it. Tell me how to prove it? Okay, what do I need to prove it?

38:13 Is what I'm saying. Nine of the ten. All I need is an alibi, a credible witness. Definitely, they can put me with them on this date, said that I killed these people. You're watching way too much television. Okay, there in the cellar or something. No, I mean, it's just common sense, my lord. This is what the lawd what alibi is gonna put you there? I got a person. I got a female doctor that can put me with her. I'm not heard where you were where you were at over there across the Georgia line behind the fire station at the house over there, states that that house from Jerry Circle. Oh you talking about what I saw last time? Ye see, that's why I said, Man, it ain't even know all about that. I ain't got a new alibi now because that was your old alibia.

38:53 Oh I still the same thing I told you, Like I said, it was the. Same alabia with the same lady. That's what you're telling me. I got a fem doctor. They can put me with her and say it said in the indictment, did she I don't really know how the whole shit was worthy funny because it says that it says the male suspects entered the dwelling, and then it says something it don't never say, like it don't specify you know, cool, who and who did what? You know what I'm saying. It just stays stick. You know what I'm saying. The male suspects entered the house, and then it says they were driven. It says I followed me, activity followed Allan and Bruce in the car. Sit there, and it says you denying that? Who done told us that twice already? At least I. Told you at once. But that's why I messed up though twice. But see, that's what I'm saying, though, Man, My biggest part is, like I said, the biggest part is you made a dumb decision and here we are.

39:42 But in the beginning, though, you got understand where I was coming from. In the beginning, it was like, Okay, I'm gonna have to do whatever I can to go ahead and you know, get. Free because I ain't never been in no shit like this. I don't even know what to do right now, you know what I'm saying. So okay, furthert thing that comes to my mind with past experiences of getting in trouble, go ahead and work with them, tell them what they want to hear, know what I'm saying. And I think we told you repeatedly we didn't want to hear what you thought we wanted to hear. I want to hear the truth about what happened. And then you told us stuff. Okay. The only problem is is the stuff you told us well pretty much the same stuff everybody else told us. So we knew we were on the right track there. Considering you know that, for instance, Bruce was down here talking to us and you were up there talking to us kind of makes it real hard for you guys to coordinate a whole lot about anything that's going on. You know what I'm saying, So we knew what you were telling us in the beginning.

40:29 What's the truth. Okay, Now we also know you've had to work work your way out, you know, for what's going on. No, No, what I'm saying what I told you, I don't deny it. You know what I'm saying. Okay, in the beginning, I told y'all, yeah, I was dead. I said, I held a flash length YEP, I said. You know what I'm saying, oh kind of shit. You know what I'm saying. I'm not denying at at the time, okay, that I didn't know what I told you. You know what I'm saying, I'm not denying that. Well, I'm I'm denying when why I fucked that was, like I said, I should have never said I was there. You know what I'm saying, I ain't had nothing to do with killing nobody. You know what I'm saying. I might have known about the ship and all this other shit, but as far as I have anything to do with it, but. Tell me what you know about it. Tell me it's as simple as that. It's like I said, I knew, I knew basically what happened in.

41:10 There ain't no basically on we don't deal in this little you know something something sort of might have. I mean, you got something to tell me that that that you say it's gonna clear you tell me, you plain english, what you trying. What you're trying to tell me, don't beat around the bush and hint of different things for me to take six different ways. I mean, but you said something's gonna cleaning though, But see, I don't know what it is because like my fair and my fair seeking. There may be another another you know what I'm saying, there may be nothing that can clear you because so far, I mean, you give me about you know, three hundred different versions of things that happen. So you know, I gotta throw out at least two hundred and ninety nine of those at. Least give me. Hey, I'm vega. I know I'm blocking my own self from you know, being being excentive, so you know what I'm saying.

41:52 But I mean, you know what I mean. You keep giving me a story, but then you don't give me nothing to back it up. You know what I'm saying. But see that's the point though, Like I mean, if I tell you I'm a police officer, you want to see some credentials and Stuss damn music police offer you give me something that you ain't give me nothing to back it up, and never give me nothing to back it up? What what? What do you need? Though? That's what I'm saying. What do ya tell me this? Tell me the truth? No, I tell me this, I need the truth. What did you know? What did you see? What was your role in all this? And don't try to tell me you didn't have no role in this? Okay, I'm gonna tell you this though. It like I said, And the murder, I ain't nothing to do with no murder. Okay, you just say that. Till the day I died, they did all three of them, had three of them. Okay, just from my understanding, Man, all I knew was symbol is this? You know what I'm saying. I knew, like I said, it was involved.

42:35 In the lick. It was involved in money. I'm interested. You know what I'm saying. A symbol is that it came down the money, and then later it came down to Yo, two people died for this ship. You know what I'm saying. Oh shit, what do you mean? Two people died for this ship? You know what I'm saying. I need to know what's up. I didn't even lie in the time. Okay, I'm thinking, what can I do? You know? Tell me about the LICKT? Who planned the LICKT? What do you mean? Who planned it planned? I mean, who thought it up? Whose idea was? How hew did we get into Ali came to me, came to me with the car. I knew what to do from there. I mean just because I mean it's well, I mean, I had past experience. How did you get like that? They stole the card? How they got together to steal a car? That was all from No, Like I said, that's a Tiffany. Tiffany knew the girl Tiffany moved these people she knew these people had money. The people used to live with her.

43:18 You know what I'm saying, how long? How long you know that one? Since two thousand week we moved to July, Yeah, I said about eight. When we're living in Arlington, you hear each other. I lived in the club, he lived in Images. So I mean total times you know each other walk here from the time that I met him to the time we got arrested and out of years. We moved to Florida in July or oh fourth, and y'all arrested us in July oh five. Moved to Florida down there for me and card you and Carlon. Yeah, okay, where'd you move from Charleston? From Charleston North Charleston live Son, I mean, where were you at just shiit? Uh? Well Most car Standing. Yeah, we heard well West Ashley because I stayed with her, and then we moved from there to Most Corner, and then from Most Corner that's when I came.

44:04 That's when we came out of Florida. We didn't even know where we was gonna live. Youl Carmen came down here together, we said, at the airport for like a month and then we found the apartment in the club and got a head from there. She and Carmen come down here. And then you met Alan when you got here. Yeah I met No, I met Allen. This this sounds crazy, but I met Alan through ecstasy. You know what I'm saying. Damn, like the. Drugs or the clock drugs are a stripper. Okay, my fall that shit clarified that. No, through the drugs. But now actually I mean the party you're rolling selling, singing or she just laying. He knew somebody that had the fiells you you know what I'm saying. And I knew the same person from being in the strip clothes and Carmen and shit, and we just oh, I live over here, Yeah I live over here. Oh what's up? Hell? You doing? You a close spot? So you just start hanging from there. Okay, now you say the three of them came up with this plot.

44:50 Now see this is all I knew. Like I said, he came to me. He was like, look, okay, I got a lick. You know what I'm saying. He has seen me pull links. I just hit a lick, you know what I'm saying. All this sudden he knows I'm good with it. Okay, I got somebody to call it instantly. That's the first thing that'll go through my mind. I got somebody call, he calls me. I come down there. You know what I'm saying. Okay, what's gonna work to Florida? You know what I'm saying, I come down here. What's the deal man? Look over one hundred thousand and over one hundred thousand supposedly Tiffany talking about the lady said they told some kind of condo or some type of fucking townhouse they had for over ninety nine thousand dollars and shit. Okay, my answers is peak. I'm ready to get the money. You know what I'm saying, but I ain't asking I should ask question you know what I'm saying, But I ain't asking no questions because in my mind, it's like. You think you just gonna get some call, get the money, and I'll ask of anything.

45:33 So on, y'all, how do you know Tiffany? I know Timany because I robbed Tiffany. That's how I went way back Charleston. Yeah. Now I met Tiffany, And didn't you tell me before about taking a cocaine? Yeah? I found a box that had I ain't know it was cocing in Now, it just happened. You don't have to weeding it money in it. I just jacked. Oh. I mean that was in Charleston. How long ago was that in Charleston? May? May? This year? No, I mean last last year? Five? Yeah, because this is what happened. I met Tiffany in May. I came back. I left Florida in February seventh. I turned myself back into Berkeley County, did three weeks in attend center they rent, stayed in my parole in relationship, Yeah, pretty much. I went from there, uh, stayed out of TRUP.

46:15 Everything was fine until the month of May. I met Tiffany Jack in the hotel the next mo. When you did that, the name of the hotel, the budget, and a little cheap cheap ass there on International Boulevard on the International you know what the airport is? Yeah, Internet, you got on Best Western travelizing budget is like the last one back there. I met her in May. Let's see, I hit a link for like probably like fourteen thousand dollars. I ain't hit the link. The dude gave me the money. But you know what I'm saying, we sorted. I saw it, helped him out with some shit. He gave me fourteen thousand dollars. On my car to Island. It was to deal with that.

46:56 He just was he seeing with somebody in Basically, I co the dude. I told the dude. I was like, look, you know what I'm saying. I was I'm saying, I know it's bad. You know what I'm saying, man, you know that's what it is. I kind of dude. He was like, look, I got Warrington take He's an older dude. He was a retired senior chief and all this shit. But he had problems. You know what I'm saying. He had fun. Then help him out until you got the cash, you know. I told him. I was like, look, nah, nah, he handed me the money in his way. I went in my way. So tell me I didn't steal nothing from what what he give me the money for? He sold his house. He's he believed I made him believe that I was a fed right, And then I got. I know it sounds what did you tell me? FBI d e A just tell how they are. But nah, he thought you were hunting them or they were hunting them, and you're gonna let him slide. Man, look at it, touch Dorman.

47:46 I got on that computer. I mean, I mean, miracles happened. I'm talking about. I created Warrens. You know what I'm saying. I found out, just burnt him out showing they had ship. Nah, you can go to what's called it the n c I thing credit card thirty dollars a month, Ben you can check on yourself anything like. You can get copies. It's it's hard to get into it, but you know what I'm saying. You can get copies, you know, like you said, it'll print out. You can get it with a scanner. You can create anything. How long before you met Tiffany? Did you? Did you get him? I knew him at the same time I met him. That was in May, also April, or I knew I met Keith in April. Yeah, I met Keith in April. Got the money June fourteenth. So in between April and June fourteenth was the last day I seen Keith. So and Tiffany happened in May because that's when we did the That's when I.

48:31 Went to the hotel. Because Keith was at the hotel. I made him believe he Look, you gotta go away from your house for a little while. You know what I'm saying. They're gonna be coming by a liquor for you whatnot. He was in the house and I got a bunch of information on him. Then that was that man. He's like, look, I'm going back to California. I'm gonna sell my house. I was like, okay, look, we do whatever I can to help make the warrants go away. You know what I'm saying, whatever shit, Okay, your warrants is gone away. But you know I'm gonna charge you. I ain't even come out of her No, give me fourteen thousand dollars, you know what I'm saying. I like, look, it's gonna be a substance. A substance amount. He got like she only got like ninety six thousand dollars for his house or something. He was like, here you go for it. Oooh okay, you know, I have a good life, you know what I'm saying. I hope everything works out for you know.

49:12 I called Alan down there. And what's weird though, me and Tiffany actually was cool at that time because I don't know what it was, but she was like, well, you know what I'm saying. She got I guess she got attractive by the shoe. She liked you. I robbed the girl or something. But I'm not gonna like, no motherfucker that steals fucking eight hundred dollars or some shit for me. But it's worth though. Man, I'm not feeling like that. Erstus. So now you call that one up. He was down there, come and say, look, man, I'm about to send you some money. Jump on the train. You know what I'm saying, Shoot down a charsta. He was like, all right, man, man, send him like two hundreds and change. He comes down there with shooting murdur Eas meet him. Her and another girl, black girl, black girl. What's her name? Ayisha, Keisha? Some ship like that. I don't think it's it's.

49:52 Sure, yeah, it's sighted Easha. Anyway, that Naisha. That was nice. It's Tiffany's friends. She's from home. He was from New York. She was from New York. Anyway, damn on we go to Murdury. Be's I'm spending money left and right. I mean, haveing fun. You know what I'm saying. Fucking I ain't got nothing better than man I'm having a fool and this shit. Man, anyway, damn do that for about a week, shoot back down here. I go back to South Carolina, holand goes to Florida. I don't know what the hell really Tiffany's doing. I wasn't really in touch with it like that. Next time, no boom, Alan calls me up. Hey, I got another lick? Oh how much like I said one times? Man, I'm rolling away, bro, I didn't get.

50:33 Down here in the car? Which car? Then in the rental car? Okay, he'll run in the car. Tiffany run in the car. So she's back up there. Yeah, she's in Charleston at the time, I thought she was down here. And that's why I was confused, cause so she's in Charleston. When Allen caught you, Yeah, Anna calls me up. I'm like, all right, bet, what's the deal? I call her? She calls me up. We get the rent a car. Who were going down here? Allen comes at me, hands me a little credit card. It ain't got no name on it. He was like, look, just go check it out. Here go the information. He goes this, here goes that. Go pep the shit out. I go peep it out, and I'm showing them a like thirty thousand dollars on the account and the savings account that shows like nine thousand in the checking account. I'm like, I can't do shit with this with then in my mind, I'm like, I still gonna get whatever I can that's up.

51:13 Before or after they'd already done everything. This was after this, after this, this the hell, yeah, it was after ship anyway. Damn. This was July. He called me Friday. I didn't hit Florida till shit, it was late. It's late as a month or yeah. Matter of fact, check the the what you call it, dum, what's the ship? The picture where they got me staying in front of lit hm and she The first time I did it, I just met with him within the hour I was up there, and that by I start checking that damn thing. That's why I said that time right there. Within within that hour too, I'll say two hour period. I just hit Florida. So it's the middle of the night, yeah, in the morning something like that. And I know the time.

51:54 I know it was the middle of the night. That's all I know. His mom wasn't there. He told his mom to go stay with her boyfriend and some ship like that, because some dudes are knocking on Allen's door or some ship like that, and they were trying to beat his assid he was nervous. I don't know anyway, Damn hey the card I come back told him the deal. Win got a room over there? What you get a room the hotel by the Dennys war. Up behind the Dennis. Right next to it is you can walk to the Dennis from the park, right, I mean it's right there. The lobby's right next It's just there's a little on same side of the straight, Yeah, the same side the street. There's a little detective or gas station and the hotail. Yeah, there's a cop car right there. Ship, there's a cop car right there behind the fence by the lobby and ship like that.

52:36 Okay, anyway, damn. Ship, I was here pretty much get as much money as possible him, him, Bruce, her, you know what I'm saying. Whatever, And then coming down to Charleston, we all meet up meet him and her. That's when I call. It, y'all. When when that's who on went to Charles? When when your Bruce appeared in all this Bruce is there that night when you get there. Yeah, Bruce was there that night when me and Tiffany got there, Bruce and Allen was there. Bruce Hon was at this house. And like I said, okay, I'm taking money. You know, I hung out when we probably was together. Shit, I ain't gonna say a week. We was probably together a couple of days. Next time. I know, we all meeting up in Charlton. But it's just me, Tiffany and Allen. We had the best Westering ruins. And in her name, how'd y'all get to Charleston separate?

53:18 I was already in Charleston. I was my grandmother when he left here. After you did the cards and you stayed And how long did you stay in the hotel by the Dennis Ship? Like I think it was just that night. Every might have been more than one night, because I know we stayed in that hotel. We stayed in the one across the street. Like, if you pull out that far a lot, you go directly across the street, there's another hotel. Right, there's a little cheap, rinky than Gass hotel. You don't know what I'm talking about, exactly what you's talking about right across the street. You gotta go across across Lane Avenue the other side of the street. Ain't talking about the day's end of the verminer now, ain't talking about them. A talking to the north of down Town. You come out there on Lane Avenue is the main road right there. Yeah, I know that. When you came off Lane Avenue, if you came from my town, come down Lane Avenue. You took a left, went around the gas station, past the Dennys, and there's the hotel. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. But you'd be out you have to take a right off Lane to go to the other hotels. There's no other hotels on that side. Okay, I'm saying, all of stays in Deerfield apartment right.

54:17 Okay, so you come out Deerfield and you bought a right that's going towards the interstate. Right, you know what I'm saying. The hotel, the first will tell me that it's on the right. The other one's on the left. That's hom Lane Avenue going left. That's old Alley. I don't even know what the bowling out there. I don't know Lane Avenue like that. Only time the two hotels over there. Yeah, cross the street from each other. Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. The Diamonding was right there, and that other hotels right there, and then there's a third hotel right there. That's why I was asking. Oh, I don't know, I just. Know it was. I ain't talking about, like I said, the days and I know the days in the order the other side of the interstate. Yeah, I ain't talking about those. Now there's an executive n uh budget in and Diamond her Diamond hotel, and it was the Buzzy and it was I know, it was a cheap, cheap ass hotel.

54:58 You like you had sliding glass oars and ship then anyway, damn. She stayed one two nights in Dominant. You remember the first hotel. First night I stayed there and then you moved to the other hotel. Nah, actually ship I stayed. I stayed with Allen h stayed at the Comfort in at the beach, Okay. But then you hit hit and you did all that cramp. You stayed at the Holiday Inn at and what's the ship called. I know there's a waffle house right beside it. I don't know, like I know, it's a bunch of rich people to live around there. It's offered. It's off the interstate. There's an embassy suite trad there.

55:40 How j T b on know what j TV is Turner Butler or somewhere down there. I know you gotta I got a night's only one way. There's only one way in and one way out. I think I know what you're talking about on money. So now you stayed at all these places, and you said you go back to Charles. Yeah, What's like, how do you get back to Charleston? The reason we went back to Charleston was you get back to you said, you met up and you got me. Tiffany came back to Charleston. What happened? Alan and Bruce? Allan and Bruce was here. Ala went to his house and Bruce we dropped Bruce off in Bigger County. Bruce was like, I gotta go people to be people to be asking questions. When did you drop Bruce off from Baker? I mean, was it with you the whole time in all these hotels? No? No hell on the Bruce Bruce. I mean what Bruce stayed with us at the night that I got on the night that I came there and got the credit card?

56:26 Was that them hold up ship even before that, man, I mean after that, Bruce stay with this at they're really cheap ass hotel. And he didn't stay with us at that the first hotel, but he was like there for like whatever. But he I mean, but he didn't stay there because him, he stayed at Allen's. Us. Bruce was with us from the all also that the first night, not the first night, the first I tell about Daddy's who all stayed there? You and Tiffany, Yeah, me, Tiffany and Allen and Alan Tiffany And I don't. Even know if he stayed there because I think he went home too, because he. Was like right there. I just remember he was down. I remember he was there like whatever, but I mean gives from Baker County, yeah, right, and then and then we dropped out and off and then me and her shot back here.

57:10 What'd you dropped off the house state? He stayed in Diffield, Christ and you shot back to South Carolina just you and Tiffany. Yeah, nobody else. I got the Minster, she got the Luman. You know what I'm saying. She's telling me. So she got two cars down there. Yeah, she already had her she had her car. Now her car was that it was a green Lubla when the Mazda was the g real car. Now, right, So I got the Masda. You know what I'm saying. I'm driving the mas and ship. She's got the luman pretty much, this, this and that the third to ride a car that you mean? Why the car She's already got a Lumina. Oh no, we were ready the car on. But you came down together in the car, didn't it. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. She was like, look, we gonna wreck the car and we're gonna go down there. So where'd the Luna come from? That's her car she going for? How to get she had them allud, that's my question? How to get to Florida with? Yeah, you said got him till they rode down together and the Mansda that. But you said when you run back, you took the Monster and she took the Loop. Yeah.

58:04 She we me and her came back to Charleston together. I took the Monster and went away and she got the Loop. Then when you left Florida, you FoST left in the monster. Yeah, that was what you just spent. It sound like you took the Monster back to Charleston. I wonder where when it came from. Yeah, because the loop the luminer was that her brother was driving Charleston the whole time, right, her brother was driving them home. So you and she go back in the monster. Then when you get to Charleston. I got to take the monsters, because she kept mentioning about I gotta take you back. I gotta take about like, look, I'm don'ta pay for it. I don't worry about this word don't pay for it. But that's a good line anyway. You just jumping off, So what you do with it? Damn? She was like, look told us now. She was like she was like she called me.

58:47 She was like, no, Alan called me. They was like, Ala was like, look, I'm in Charleston. I don't get the Charleston. He was like, I'm up here with Tiffany and Ship. I was like where Bruce had. It's like, Bruce back and make your county shit. I was like, okay. He was like, look needs more money. No, he was like the card is fucked up. That's what he told me. And that's when I called y'all. And that's when really the whole shit came to play, and I was like, Okay, I was like, gonna tell Tiffany to get a room, and it was hard to get a room with some bullshit like that. I don't remember you got the rooms. I get there and that's when it was like bam. He handed me the car and shit and he was like, look, we try to car, try depend up it. It wouldn't work. I was like, fuck so them no. That's when he was like Dante called. That's when he told me. He was like, look, shit fucked up. And I was like what do you mean? And that's when the whole shit came about the fucking people. I was like, what do you mean about the people? And he was like, look, fuck them, situation. I need to help you get out the shit.

59:37 You know what I'm saying. And I was like, what do you mean? He was like, the car don't work. No more. Police already go about the people and shit they talking about uh Dante's mom, police stuff been up there. They didn't see in the car from a helicopter and shit. I'm like, slow, damn man, what are you talking about? And that's when the whole shit happened about the people. And I was like, okay, well, I'm gonna help you out that's the first thing that came to mind. You know what I'm saying, I gonna help you out, get the fuck the situation. I'm gonna help you out what happened. That's when he breaks the shit down to me, tells me about burying the people. You know what I'm saying. Him and Bruce stunted out the whole the ship was Tiffany basically, like I said, the ship is Tiffany's on you know what I'm saying, And the ship went from there. Alan knew I could get there with that car. You know what I'm saying. I told Alan, I ain't a lot to you in the beginning. I asked him. I was like, why didn't you just tell me about the murder? Why didn't you ask me to help you with the murder? You know what I'm saying, Because I mean, you know how shit is. Shit's fucked up.

1:00:21 You can't trust nobody, man. But you went down there to help me with the lick initially, didn't you. Yeah, But stealing some money is a bit different from killing two fucking people. You know what I'm saying. I told you all this, man, And look, I don't care if you quote me I'll say this into in front of the judge. Man, and this is serious shit. If I kill them people, man, I wouldn't have no where, I wouldn't have no co defendits. Man. I mean, my grandmother, is, my uncles, everybody just taught me. But man, murder is the easiest, easiest charge in the world to get away with, you know what I'm saying. Not in your case, No, he'll feel what I'm saying. Though. It's one of the easiest things to get away with though, you know what I'm saying, But it's one of the hardest things to do. You know what I'm saying. That's that's when people fuck up. I don't think it's too easy to get away with it either. The perfect crime isn't one nobody knows about it.

1:01:03 Well, look at all the unsolved murders that are in this world. That's because one mother did it. Look at all the solved murders that there in this world. I don't know it. You know what I'm saying. Sometimes it's just one person that don't make any damn difference. But that's a stupid motherfucker though, you know what I'm saying, that's a probably nine out of ten is a person that didn't. It wasn't premeditative murder. I'll put it that way. This wasn't pre meditated. No, I'm saying about if a person that usually nine oft of ten gets caught, I'm pretty sure it ain't premeditated. The person's gonna sit there and plan think acted out. Come on, man, you're gonna literally go through your brain. Okay, I gotta do this. I'm smart enough to know how to do this. Come on, They probatically put it on TV how to get away with anything these days. You. Yeah, I gotta be honest with you. You're one of the best storytellers I've ever heard in my life. You know. But but but you're spending stories to me. Man. That's why I say.

1:01:46 I mean, it's there like a I can camp fire or something in the jail. If that everybody gets around the night and listens to you spend stories because you're good man. Like I said, full of it. But you're good. Listen. I got told you from the beginning. I fucked up. You know what I'm saying. Saying thing I told my grandma. My grandmother asked, why did you do that? It wasn't the simple fact that you know what I'm saying. Okay, what why don't we go back to to to the first story you told us, which is, oddly enough, I remember everything I told oddly enough mine, that's the one I believe. Okay, because that's the first one you're gonna read. Because okay, you know now, I mean out in the room, let phrase that. The beginning of the story you told us that night was total crap. Okay, the beginning. I don't know nothing about it. Nothing. You didn't call anybody. I don't I would never call the freaking police. You think I'm stupid, Well, I spoke to you.

1:02:33 You want to hear it on tape? Okay, Yeah, I called the police. Okay, Yeah, I mean we went around and around around, and you kept kind of sort of remembering that. Okay, Yeah, okay, we got you on that one. So I'll go ahead and come clean on that. And that's what I just told you though. I told him I would help him out. And that's when I called y'all. You know what I'm saying. I called y'all. Okay, I don't even know how to sell man. So you send her tell us, tell us and expect us to believe that after Alan Waite's this here and tells you that that he and Bruce killed this old couple. Bruce, I mean Alan somehow makes it back to Charleston, comes and talks to you, admits everything, and then and then gives you gives it, gets back, gives you the card back, and then and talk and and and pretend to be the dead guy. No.

1:03:15 See, he gave me the card because I was like, Okay, I'm gonna either get on the phone, I'm gonna get on the internet. I'm gonna try to do something to open the card up, you know what I'm saying, to get the money. That's how it richen. He didn't tell me, hey, we just killed two people. Here, get this card open for you. What I'm saying in the beginning, he didn't say he goes the card you know what I'm saying. Or no, he didn't say we killed two people. Get the card on. It was get the card on. This is how this is what happened. Doesn't lost your mind? You know, I lose the mind. Everybody else's story don't match nothing to you. That who I ain't got nothing to do with. Everybody was this lord, here's your problem. You do have everything to do with that and your story you just told us interesting as it was, it's crap and I can prove it. Well. First of all, you Alan and Tiffany went together and the Silver Monster back to Charleston. Okay, well though splitting up none of the ship. You want to see the video from you guys at the Endmark gas station and pull Or Georgia when he stopped for gas on your return trip. Where are you?

1:04:09 We went back and forth to Florida and saw it was about ten times. No, no, I, this was the day of you can admit es is the day before you were caught using the victims card. I have all of that on video and it didn't work. That's right, But you three her together on your return trip, ain't. No Alan suddenly shows up bullshit? Okay, he rode with you up there. You you can't even look me in the eye and tell me that. Now, listen, you're right. He rolled with it. But like I said, he was up there fifty times. He was stopped talking with you up and down he screw around me. Now he could be up there fifty times, he wasn't up and down there fifty times in the Master with the victim's card after they were dead. Okay, because you didn't have that kind of time. Okay. The first time we talked to you, Okay, the first time we talked to you, which you meaning night Tuesday night around the little left well was close to midnight. No, it was close to midnight that I spoke to you. Okay.

1:05:03 That was the first time I spoke to you. Okay, Wednesday, Okay, Wednesday, we already had the full history of where you've been with that car, okay, and then Thursday and then got arrested in Charleston. Okay. You didn't have time to go back and forth. I'm back and forth like you're trying to sell me. Okay, you just went back up there because in between that time we got the rental car, we got all kinds of crap. Okay, we have you are Italian. Tuesday was hard up there. The rental car was put there Tuesday and Wednesday night, the day before we got arrested. No, Tuesday night, the night I went to that hotel when I met all them, when I went went to them and the Best Western, that rental car was dropped off right there inside the Home Enterprise.

1:05:46 When you picked up the Lumina and you all left in the together, you Tim for me and Allen. That's what I'm saying. That's the same night that we was at the hotel the Tuesday night. You know, about twenty minutes ago. You told me that you Tiffany went up there together, and somehow I just showed up and called to you and said, I need your. Help, I need money, I need your help. Okay, that's bullshit. He went with you and the freaking Mazda from Florida to Charleston. It was with you the entire time win them. You know. I'm say let me, let me put this real simply. Okay, After you all went to the people's house and took them with leg and took them to Baker County, Okay, and buried them alive in a fucking hole, and then went and hit the ATM machine and went to the hotel. Okay.

1:06:26 After you did all that stuff, Okay, then y'all stopped in Georgia on the way to Charleston. Then you'll get to Charleston, and I've got all your little ATM videos and attempts to use the card all the way along the way. The store has an excellent video. By the way, I watched Mazda pull up. Watch all you three jokers get out of the Mazda okay, and go in the store. So at no separate cars he met us. Crap. Okay, you gotta think of a new story, because that's when they'm working for me. Now this is even better. Okay, consider them. You didn't get there till what three am something like that, and you immediately went and you see a ATM machine. That's what I did. Then. It's really really hard for me to have you on video in the Walmart and normally Boulevard before that. Real difficult, isn't it? At the Walmart? At the Walmart on video you and Tiffany okay and Alan for that matter. Oh I got so much crap. You were so freaking buried.

1:07:22 You don't even know. It's what I'm saying. You said on the night, the night that the people got killed. I'm at the Walmart. You have the Walmart. Who man, look at you? Oh wow, another bombshell. Let me say, you know all that stuff you can do because you get on the computer. Guess what. When was I supposedly at the Walmer at the time for a day supposedly. I actually on video at the Walmart. Okay that day, that Tuesday, that and Tuesday. Shit, that's try Friday. Okay to Friday. That Friday, I was at that Walmart. They gotta be on video on video before I use the card, after. I use the card before. Man, I got to see that. I got to will exhibit. It's gonna be like nine seventy six with your your your mud on it that we get the show when we go to court. I got to see that one.

1:08:10 Yeah, the lawyer ain't. Sharing all this with you. A lot of people about to get a new lawyer. Man, your people, because I don't know whatever it is doing. I got news for you. Your attorney that you have now, it's a good attorney. We gotta get Bill severy to whoever fun that is. They said it. Damn, he's he's supposed to be good. Please send him to speak to me. I'm just saying, that's what. Damn. Because Rigimon, I ain't got no there's been eight months. I ain't got no copies of discovery. I don't know what's going on. Man, They've been to see me one time in eight months. Well, I don't know what's going on man, who wait, damn writing y'all trying to figure us. Well, you're right, I was hoping, will tell you something that's entertaining. Okay, it is, and we're enjoying our conversation. Get to catch you. It's good for a chop you want to you.

1:08:52 Need to write stories, okay, because you're good. Good. I'm trying. But you're right, you're trying to get your ass out of the crack. I mean, don't tell mebody you stood there while it happened. I believe you didn't do it. I know you were. Standing there watching them be buried alive. I know you were standing there very lashlight while they did it. Who in the right mind would say that and make you that ship up? You know what I'd say if I was like myself, wasn't another freaking state way California? Yeah, exactly, except you know the video on the Walmart would prove if you want California. So we're not gonna worry about that. The best thing you can he was to tell me the truth instead of scrunting around with this crowd. I mean, you already are should happen, whether you knew what was gonna happen or not okay, okay, what it is?

1:09:40 So for what I'm meaning, so right now, though you know what I'm saying, I'm a little confused because it's like I ain't necessarily saying I'm confused, but okay, if you telling me, ain't telling me. It's like I don't heard this, this and that third you know what I'm saying from each person, I'm like, okay, that's how I don't know what you're saying. I'm talking about as far as Bruce saying this, Ali saying is the actually Alan, I ain't. From what I heard, Alan said nothing about nothing yet. So the girl saying this, and it's like I'm not asking a little. I was like, well let me let me work with him. You know what I'm saying, Let's see what we can do. And he's talking about, well, they ain't trying to do nothing. They're trying to need elandatory life with a deathfinity. I'm like, what hold. Up, man, I ain't kill nobody. Man, Okay, if I knew about it, if I did anything, I ain't kill nobody. You know what I'm saying. I don't. I ain't get that need to stop screwing around and tell us the whole truth. Okay, I know you were there, Michael, listen to me, living finished? Okay, do that exit? Did I did you know what's gonna happen? I don't know.

1:10:33 I do. I know you were there? Yeah, I know you were there. That DNA shit that should approve if it's like, okay, no DNA is at that, that'll prove I wasn't there? Right? No? What can if? What? What do I need to prove that I wasn't there? Okay? What do I need to prove that I wasn't at that place while then people were being batter. That's up to you. If you weren't there, then for show some proof that you weren't what? What do I need? That's what I'm to tell me. If you weren't there, you should be. You should be able to prove that the easy okay. And what y'all gonna do? Y'all gonna turn around. See, we got this whole bunch of shit. You know they have to still can tie you in it. You tell me you know you in it. You're fucking in it. You're facing capital. You can sit here and try and spin it however you want, Okay, And I can understand God knows, I'm not in your position. I'm glad, I'm not, okay, but I can understand wanting to make me believe that you weren't there. But it ain't gonna happen. Okay, I've been doing this for too long. I have too much evidence, way too much evidence for me to ever believe that you weren't there. Okay, I will never believe evidence there if you're there holding the light and you know you think they're just strolling around. Okay, but you gotta tell me that ship. If if Alan did something specifically, you need to tell me something then instead of you know, in such and such as said something something, and if if Brouce did something specific specific now what you saw specifically?

1:11:52 What you saw? I mean, did you see some you know, did you see Tiffany pick up a shovel and away lay these old people? Or did you see Alan do something them specifically? Or did you see Bruised do something specifically you know, exact action that they did where you're standing there going holy shit, this is going bad. I mean, what what's going on at that time? Because I'll be astraving. I ain't never gonna be lave you weren't there, Okay, because we got way, We're way past that way. There's evidence that can improve I was there. There's evidence that's got you in a world problems right now. I mean I know that I don't deny it, you know what I'm saying. But is there evidence that improve I was there? That's what I'm saying. You have having approves you're not? Who do you have evidence to prove you're not there? Keep talking about some friend or some sort of doctor or something. I'm gonna show me anything anything You have yet to give me anything or any reason for me to be because everything you told me, then you know that you want me to believe other things. I can prove that you're lying. Okay, So here's your problem. Now, you told one hundred and ten lies. Why the hell am I going to believe the next thing that comes out of your mouth?

1:12:54 Of course? Okay? And I'm not doing that. I didn't I didn't put any words in your mouth. I didn't ask you to tell me anything. All I've asked you for is the truth from the freaking beginning. Tell me the truth, okay, the exact truth. That's all I've ever asked for. That's all I want in this. Okay. If you went down there for a lick, You went down there for a lick. Okay. Now, if you didn't know shit was gonna carry it out far, you didn't know. Now when you get there and shit's happening and something's going through your minds, and I need to know about that shit too, Okay. If you know what was talked about or what was planned, I need to know about that stuff, Okay, because the only thing right now that that we don't have is the one hundred percent truth. Okay, But I've got about why. I've got more than enough to put it all together. You know, when I've got you know. I mean, we'll just start with your your repeated use of the ATM card and understanding that at nearly every attempt you made, whether you got cash or not, I have you on video. So that's a beautiful timeline to put you in different places at different times, which can prove that you worn't in other places at certain times. Now we'll just go from there to the rental car. Okay, rental car had GPS on it, so that puts you in certain places at certain times.

1:14:04 In the rental car, that puts the car there though. I mean, okay, let's look at it like this. I guess what doest thrust of the people you're with put you there? Okay? Yea damn. I mean that's like, okay, it's like me and you committed crime. Oh he did it, No, he did. But you're gonna accuse me of committing a crime with you. I'm gonna say, if where was I with when this crime is supposed to be committed? You said, bullshit, I was like a little champ, a little burg road. Go check the video. You can't give us nothing like that, okay, because it wasn't It wasn't. There. You already told us you were there. Everybody else told us you were there. So okay, well right now, I mean, you can think of stories all day, but it ain't gonna help. That's what I'm saying. So right now, the only thing I don't. Know is the only thing I don't know is you know, were you taking part in putting those people in the ground or where you standing there? Going this is fucked up.

1:14:49 That's the only thing I don't know. Okay, that's the only thing I don't know about this whole scenario. And I don't know exactly. You know, if the smart yeah what the satellite receiver had a little smart cards, you can get free video and stuff off of put in another card that was missing out of the victim's house from you know earlier. That's not here there, you know, you know, and then we'll just go okay, just just go to the next level. You're the computer guy, right, You're the one who knows how to do that shit. You're smart enough to do it right now and play games. I mean, I know you can work that shit, Okay. I also know that Tiffany ain't smart enough to do it, okay, and I'm damned out in my mind she couldn't do it if she wanted to. You know, I'm not lying bright Okay. And then we got Alan. Alan knew how to do it, he wouldn't be calling you to do it, Okay.

1:15:40 It's not exactly Rockets. Obviously, you're the one that has the computer knowledge. Okay. You're the one smart enough to find that shit on the computer and take care of it. You told us that yourself, that's why they brought it to you to take care of Okay, you go through all that shit. You're the only one that's gonna be smart enough to take all the freaking bank records out of the house, all the insurance information to rattle off ship to me on the phone like such a security numbers address. You tried to bullship me on the dog's name, but you screwed that up. Okay, I mean you came up with all kinds of crowd but it was wrong. Okay, you buried yourself. You're already buried. Okay, and you did it. I didn't do it, now, I give it. Yeah, Okay. I did my homework before I came to see you. Okay, the first time in Charleston, I knew everything about you. Man, What about what do you mean about? There's nothing to know about me. I'm not a bad person. I don't have no value. You weren't a bad person. I mean you taken it for fourteen grand claiming you are us Marshall.

1:16:35 You might rob me of my dope from my shit in my box, but you know that that'd be different. But you know that if that, if that, if you define that as not being a bad person, then okay, okay, but we're on a different level now because I get dead people. I give what you're saying. But I ain't take no wady for the money. That man gave me that money, I'm not gonna refuse it. Did you not bullshit him into thinking he had warrants as you just explained to me you could do on the computer. He's got your hell out of town and you were helping him out, so he just gave you the money. I had to bands everything. Oh, you know, Michael went. When we talked that night in Charleston, we talked about that, and I said, you know, why didn't you interfere or stop them in any way when they were burying these people alive? And you said, because you know up in New York you can get you know, you know, you know you could be the next one. I see, you know, don't you have a conscience? And you told me you did have a conscience. I said, for that very action of not interfering on that is not having a conscience.

1:17:23 It's a definition of not having a conscience, is what he said. That's not man, there's too many definitions for conscience. M Okay. So I mean I'm here as trade with it, Michael. At this point, yeah. Okay, at this point, I'm at I'm at a I'm at it, like you said, it's like this supposed I mean, I'm gonna say, suposy, I'm gonna say, y'all got enough evidence. You know what I'm saying. I can timey, and I ain't gonna say time. I'm gonna say, put me here, put me there, put me here, for me there, put me there. You know I could put you with everybody involved in this prior to you, during and follow murder. That's bad, okay, and then voice yeah, that's bad. Okay, Then we have this.

1:18:08 You know, now you know they're dead, and you still tap into ATM cards. We'll pick them a circumstance. You're a victim of your own ego. Man, greed, greed, greed, definitely agreed greed. Yeah. But when it comes, like I said, the murder and death. Not, I mean, you're so damn sure to tell me that you didn't kill them, Tell me what the hell happened? Make me believe it. I mean, how am I supposed to do that? Tell me the truth? Tell me what happened? When? When? When? When you leave I know you, I know you're at the house already, Okay, when you leave there, okay, when you leave there? You know there's a retired comicide detective that has a private investigation from at the park where you guys were hanging out before, by the victim's house.

1:18:59 Who came right there? Wait, I just saw them down there. But yeah, take me out though I wasn't never tasting no football with nobody in front of no park, in front of the house. I don't know where that came from. Somebody, glease tell me where that came from. I got to see this video. That was one video I can I just said, no video. He said there were people. Helloyd told me that city said the state had an investigator something that saw me Alan Bruce, the girl and somebody don't. Want a football in the park and some football or basketball or somebody. I said, shit got proved out. I know that was a bullgit man. Got Do you feel some compassionate about your defensive thing the football? Yeah, because I know that that's some bulls. But you don't argue about Detective Meechamson. You're telling you you're at a team getting murdered.

1:19:41 He's wonder the same, damn neighborhood or nothing. He was just saying, man, But I mean, okay, like I said, you got all this evidence. Thinking time of it is if I sit there and tell you, you know what I'm saying. See, I can't even do that because you want me to tell you something that I can can't tell you. That's the part I don't get. Well, if you can't bring yourself to tell me bringing myself to tell you. Is you want me to tell you something I can't tell you. You want to say what happened? You know you won't tell an It won't is it can't because if you do, you feels condemn what happened to those people? Yeah, I can tell you what I was told all day. Tell us what you saw it happen.

1:20:23 Did people get killed out and not see that ship happened? You're standing You said there, told me they were big. Told you light that they groaned when they dropped him in the hole. They were still alive. How about this statement? Hey, hey, how about this statement? Bruce took him to the bodies. Bruce just fucking hum us all. He just fucking humless. Yeah, yeah, I remember saying that, saying that, But at the same time, that can be taken No, no, no, no, no, no, you be taking one one. I'll take bets on how that them is gonna be taken in front of twelve people. You gotta get your mom. You gotta give me some fucking bond. I gotta get out of here. Yeah, he took, he said wanted me to. I said, give me the Florida, give me once I get the fuck on out of you.

1:21:05 Man. But I did not mean I'm you know, haul ass and not come back. Look, if I was you, I would haul lass and not come back. I'd be on my computer making new ideas. Do you have to lose? Do you have to lose? I've been on the run before. I know how to say you were on the run. Over found you. It was there. I wasn't on the run. I mean I could have went back and they would have locked me up for nine months of the left ten months. Between nine and eleven months. I would have had not have. Been on I wasn't on no runs. But I've been on that run ship. I know how I'm trying to live like that. Man. Nothing, She's not gonna get a bought here. I mean, if you watched all that shit happened, I didn't have nothing to do it. You need tell me about it. You need to tell me every last listen.

1:21:48 Love it Okay, Okay, if I did okay, listen, if I did watch it happen, I said they had nothing to do it. How is that gonna help me? There's no way possible that can help me. Doesn't hurt you. You're ared of there. Okay, I'm still gonna get man to like, I'm still gonna get a kne put them on that shit. Don't help me? Man, Ooh, let me ask you this. Let me ask you. You're an adamant you didn't do it to them? Okay, you're adamant about that positive mind. Do you feel that the people that did should be help fully responsible for it? Of course, then that's how you help yourself. Because if you ain't fully responsible, and you have evidence, a proof there shows who is fully responsible, that's on you. I mean, if you want to wear it for them, you go for it. You say you said I'm gonna have to wear it records? How am I not?

1:22:28 How am I not gonna have to weave regardless? Okay, y'all got a video that does this. I got two dead people's credit card. Man, it's in the interview. Really, well, people, twelve people. I'm going down for that. You get twelve Floridians. You know what I'm saying. Okay, they just saw me July. They said, whenever I hit the TV suspect and killing these two people, I was guilty in. Your mind already. Why are we even going to Charles? Just going how do you been there? Come on, man, what do they know about? Just like? What do they know about Alan? What do they what do they know about brutus? Maybe you provide something for them on Bruce Allen or two? We can I provide for them the truth? I think I'm lost, man. I'm not trying to be funny, but a seriously think I'm lost, okay.

1:23:08 Because you're delusional in the thinking that that you can spin this around to despinable. You're not getting out, and you're not getting out before trial. You're gonna go to trial. You're gonna sit there till trial. There's no option about that, okay. And we've been upfront about that from the beginning. That ain't gonna happen. And I've told you that several times. You ain't getting a bond. Okay, maybe you would in some other state. You're not getting a bond here. Not do to get it? One zero nothing, not nothing. Okay, So that ain't gonna happen. And we've told you that from the beginning, but you you didn't either just didn't want to believe us or just didn't believe us. We're screw that, it says, I feel, you know what I'm saying, Like, Okay, I'm charged with burd you know what I'm saying. But if I didn't kill nobody, you know what I'm saying, you ain't charge for shoplifting.

1:23:50 Men. How many guilty people have you talked to in the jail? How many people in the jail they're guilty of their crimes? None fifty fifty was the guy that you know right there in their hands, you know what I'm saying. Kind of like this case. Yeah, I mean, it's like I got one hundred fingers pointing that view right now, and it's ship. The best part is is you're holding most of them. You did all the point in yourself. Okay. So like I said, I. Mean, what what what's the best thing that can come out of it from I mean, what's the best thing that can happen to me? The best thing if the whole truth whenever y'all get did, if everything comes out, everything comes out. The absolute best thing is if if you were to be cooperative until everything the best thing is they're probably not gonna seek death bounty. Okay, but that's on the table right now. We can't make that deal. Okay, that's up to the state attorney. In your attorney. You come holy clean with them, more wholly cleaning with us. After talking with them, you know they can make those arrangements.

1:24:51 I can't do that. Okay. You're looking at some time right now, if you're convicted right now, the way things stin so you said, right now, the way things sting, charge of worship the murder. If you have full victor the first three murder, you have two penalties, life or death. That's it. I cannot he cannot make a deal. It takes that off take you said the state attorney again. The state attorney can talk with you, but I'll tell you this up front before he Yeah, listen to me. I know we don't go together. Give him, but un listen listen to him. He will make lawyer. He will not make you a promise until he's heard the whole truth and had a chance to look at it and decide if you bullship.

1:25:31 Numb or not. Okay, but how about this though, that's the fact. How about this? Okay, we say in front of him, truth come out. You know what I'm saying, the whole truth come out. And at the same time, I got a lot of ship that can help me in the process. You know what I'm saying that that's that's up to you and the attorney to discuss. Okay, I can't, I'm our attorney, say attorney, I can't. I can't. I can't make a deal with you. Okay, we're don't have the power. Round get started to Michael and if we. Did two what the hell does his name? Miss Ra? Yeah? What do you mean? It's up to they said. When I went in the courtroom, right, this is what they said. He said, like the first they started with the bond hearing thing, because Richard was like, my client, whatever data about here?

1:26:13 He said. That's when he said it was up to the detective. He said, the detectives got to put in an affidavid evidence that evidence. I don't know, no, no technique. Shit is man, I don't know how that know, we don't. But then I asked, what are we asking for? You're asking for discovery? When you're at the bond hearing everything. Okay, the David is we have to have submitted everything to the state for them to make it available to the defense. Okay, Uh, they can't give you what they don't have. In other words, no, are you talking about the bond here and a deal? You know? Imcause I asked Richard, I was. Like, we don't. We don't make the deal. Okay. What would happen is is you'd have to you'd have to tell us every day. Let us go look at everything and see if it's truthful or not. Okay, as best as we can determine. And sometimes we can say it definitely is. Sometimes we can say it definitely isn't. Sometimes we say don't know. Sounds good, But we have to feel we're getting the whole truth. If we feel like we're getting bullshitted, Why why would I kind of deal if I feel like you're just giving me half truce or something good, you know what I mean? Why would I recommend to the state that they consider what you're telling us? Okay? You know, And that's that's all we can do, is tell the state that, hey, what he's told us appears valid or so it appears like a whole another dairy story.

1:27:22 So it's up to the state of Yeah, but before he's gonna say anything, but before. He'll make a deal with you. I'm telling you right now, I know he got to go to yoth No. No, he wants to hear everything first and give us a chance to go see if it's true or if you're just blowing smoking. Yeah. So okay, I see because what if I say, hypothetically, okay, you tell me everything and I'll take this penalty off the table guaranteed. I'm kind allowed to do that. Technically, that's like a lawyer, lawyer guarantee you're going. But then you tell me you know, uh, you know it was half off and three strippers from New York that kill these people. Okay to I don't know what the hell you're gonna tell me. Ye ain't getting the deal till they know what's on the table. Okay, Okay, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, that's how now I work with a home but it's active ben Berkey County like that. On time he told me, he said, look, it's how it's gonna work.

1:28:07 You got to give me something and we'll get you up them, know me up for. Them is for here. You got to give them everything. No withholding I'm talking about them. He told me, he was like, give me something. They came and got me. I give him something. They got me a bond, you know what I'm saying. And then I helped him. Then I work with him. From the same Michael removed the word bond from you. It's probation, man. This the only thing here is you know that that The only options they have right now is to look. If they feel you're giving full, truthful disclosure, then they may be inclined to to do something with them. We can't make that laser charges on. I don't know, it's not up to us. See, Like the whole murder change is like you got to actually kill somebody to be charged with murder?

1:28:51 Right now? How does that work? That's what I need to know. How does that work? How am I being charged? It's called it cause you and I go into a convenience store to do a lake. You get pissed off and shoot and kill. You need to a clerk. They both held shoulder. But if the video shows that I was like Dolly murder role. So how how then nothing can help me. Then intent can help you. There's a difference between a fellowly murder and a first degree premeditative murder. Oh, I give what you're saying. I got the show. I ain't had no planning in killing these fucking people, and ship like that. And then oh didn't didn't hold the shovel, didn't didn't do anything else. The finger Printsy'll say, y'all got the shoves that finger prints ship out and mother, oh.

1:29:36 Man, all right, check it out, right? So we got to start from day one. Yeah, I mean, we need to start at the beginning. And you know that that's just the way it goes, all right? Is that? So like I said, I come out, you know, give y'all whatever, you know what I'm saying. And then like I said, a bunch more ship you know what I'm saying. They can't help that state attorney. Do you want to do you want to talk to your lawyer, but do you just want us to talk to the state attorney and come back and meet with you again? This is this is off the record, right. That's how between me and you, this is this is the deal. My parents told me. The way my grandma said, she said, look, you got to do the right thing. My grandma told me straight up you know what I'm saying, because it's it's fucking life at state you know what I'm saying.

1:30:16 So straight up she's handling everything. With the lawyers. Like I said, with this whole ship, would do Bill Shevard, whatever the fuck that is. But I told Nancy, the paralegal for Richard, I said, we ain't doing want to seeking co counselor you know what I'm saying, We just cause I want to get this. I want an emotional discovery. I want all this ship so I can let me see what's this funny. I want to see what's in front of me. So I didn't have any life, none of that stuff. No, he told he just wanted told me that y'all was coming to get all that. But so, like I said, and we can all sit in front of the state attorney, I don't need I don't necessarily need. Like this point. At this point, Michael, the state Attorney's gonna say, Now, that's. What I'm saying. You know, if you want us to arrange that, we can do that.

1:30:56 This is know what I'm saying. I know that you know I'm totally I told really understand that you know what I'm saying. Well, what I'm saying, I don't. Can I have my letter you comes that, don't answer. But at the same time, you can do it you want. I'm not you whatever you want you. Said, you said, you said, aside from this, you could no whole bunch of others, whole bunch of other ship. Gang of ship, what manig Like I said, how serious the stuff we're talking about? Drugs all kind of ship. I'm talking about elite right dam in front of you. Not no oh go here tomorrow, but nah, no bullshit, Like I'm talking about serious ship, some real straight up ship. Like I said, look look up the murdering blanding that happened with the expedition the dou.

1:31:40 He the dude ain't died too in the hospital, but he didn't die, but the other motherfucker got away. I know where he at right now, I said, looked at it. I think it was Clay County and some ship. I don't know how the whole border ship. I know everything in Jacksonville that, Like I said, I know what gang of drugs is, right, I'm talking about keys of dope, keys a dope, No bullshit I'm not gonna sit there, like I said, fuck the stories fun this this. Is my life. You know what I'm saying, You got a new song. If i't gonna get a bond, I at least gotta get you know, fuck that life ship. You know what I'm saying something oo, I gotta get enough man where I'll tell you what I the turn is gonna want to know what this kind of stuff. Yeah, but you just want to know about this case did on this. That's what it takes him of cause I mean, I'll be honest, Sure we love to do the rest of this check it out, but I ain't nearly as interested as that as I am in details on this because that's this is yas phone. No past I can feel them. I ain't gonna say I can feel them, but man, I got show Man. So I mean, when I think about it, write it's another note.

1:32:41 No that I mean, I know I can writch you. What I'm saying is like this from day I mean I'm talking about I'm gonna go from the time the fucking call me from there to the day y'all the rest of them. You know what I'm saying. Now, this is what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna righte shit. You know what I'm saying. Don't had the ship in front of people whatever. You know what I'm saying. Dah dah, dah dah. And like you said, if I sit in front of the say attorney, then you know, like I said, you said, then right there he said, he's got to hear it. You know what I'm saying. But then we work out something. You canna start from winning from when he called. You, from the time Alan called me, from the time he was like, look, here's the deal. I got something. You know what I'm saying, cause I ain't gonna lie. That's it. That's how the whole shit started.

1:33:21 I chilled out with Allen spending the day of fourteen thousand A doon't went his way. Me and Tiffany came back here and like I said, back to Florida, back to trash the owner, not back here, back to Charleston. That's what it was. How did how did Allen know to find these people? Alan didn't know the findest poglativity? Fine, right, so now how he called you to say check this out? How the whole shit even came about? Man? Was them We stayed the night and in people's house. We me and Tiffany came down here to visit Allen. You know what I'm saying. This is before I even got more money. Matter of fact, was it? Yeah? Hell yeah, it was before I even got my money. Came down here. Tiffany was like, I know some people down here. We can stay with you. You know what I'm saying, just to you know what, sleep real quick. And because we visited Alien.

1:34:02 But we did, we can know hotel some other bullshit? Is a card some bullshit or the fucking card I don't remember. Damn, that's what she called that, lady up, spend the night there and themn next day we was gone. When the smart card got missing, tell us the truth about that. Come on, I would tell you missing out of there she called, right, I remember because Tiffany called me. She was like, did you take a satellite card to some type of bullshit? And told her now, no, I ain't taking him. No, not for what. I don't even have a house. What when he can satellite car for. Ty sell it to somebody? No, ain't no, damn crackhead type ship man won't make money. You gonna get money, Get money, nah, damn.

1:34:44 It's like, like I said, pretty much, how long before we visited them people one more time? What't even more time? It really really just came back down here was chilling out with Autland again. And then, like I said, we went over there matter of fact, because I left for and bagging her fucking house. That's how the shit happened. I'm not a fucking nankey bag in her house. And that's when the lady was like, well, the card was missing and some shit. I was like, oh, Mandy trying to say we stole fucking satellite. I was like, no, man went in there, and I'm going through the lady shit while she's right here, you know, fucking searching behind a little dresser and shit. I'm like, man, that shit ain't here, man. And then that was the last time I sa eating people. Telling The truth is that when you saw the bank account statements. Nah, the bank account statements, Like I said, that shit came cause Tiffany Thow. That's when supposedly the lady sold with some condo with some house or some shit like that for ninety nine thousand dollars or some shit like that, And that's what I was, OK.

1:35:34 But then again. That one. In my mind, it's like, okay to get away with something, man, you can't just you know, run up in there, run out. That's the dumbest thing in the fucking world to dude. You know what I'm saying. If you're gonna get money, you know what I'm saying, If you actually, if you want to get money, money, not ten dollars, not one hundred dollars. You know what I'm saying. That shit has got to be playing, That shit's got to be done right. You know what I'm saying. You can't just whatever. You know what, this was pretty damn close. It was pretty damn close. I'm telling you, this was close a fuck the greed greed got you. It wasn't about greed. It was about greed. Man, Come on ATM card. Don't work ATM card. Don't want to turn that bitch on your tap at five times for a thousand dollars Bam bam baby ban bam, two hundred pop.

1:36:26 Because you couldn't drives fast as fast as you could, you popped it. Okay, Okay, that's greed. Okay, because if it wasn't about greed, you're just taking two hundred Know when you spend it, you're going back because. You know the card was off. You gotta get it before the car turns off again. I ain't greed, that's just being we go ahead and get this ship before they turned it off again, and then I'm stucking. You know what I'm saying. That's what that was about. That's like, that's like I'm not many times though, five times, Yeah, because you only get two hundred out of the time. How many different banks more than I could count? Many? Man, we see, like I said, a lot of them because I'm in When y'all asked me, you said, did I ever use it at Georgia? I never took money out of the thing trying, Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

1:37:06 I meant, I thought about it. I was like, why the fuck did he say that? But I remember I never took money out of it, But yeah, I was. I took I took the gas. Why we asked you which one to see if you're gonna try and lie to this or not. But I never took money out of it though, That's what That's what I thought. You meant, like, did you use it at Georgia? Did you ever take money out of the ship at Georgia. I ain't gonna bullshit. So I want to know if you got money in Georgia. Michael hod To asked you, did you get money from the car You're in Georgia. You gotta feel I'm coming from that. I don't know what's going on right now. Man. Why know, you're gonna get as rubles as you can to find out what situation you're in. And see, that's what I'm saying. We're just confront shit. I mean, I know in the world of shit. But it's like, man, I'm in a lot of ship that I shouldn't be. Okay, Yeah, you know, I know I didn't. I fucked up, you know what I'm saying.

1:37:48 But at the time, like you said, you said, the ship was close and the shit fucked up because of them dumb at them people, stupidity. Man, you know what I'm saying. First of all, I would have killed rop fucking Bidy. Man. You could have got all that money without killing anybody. You know what I'm saying. It wasn't a thirty of them. Cool. You ain't even got to scam him. Man. Oh, And I'd have got all that money without killing nobody. Man. She was the easiest. Fuck you ain't got to scam no person like that. Yeah, that's it's still fuck man for you. You you start writing and we'll come see you in a week or so. Now what I'm saying, this is what I do. Like you said, do whatever you can. But I'm supposed to call my grandma tomorrow, not tomorrow one on. Yeah, I'm calling the Thursday.

1:38:33 I gonna call her. I'm gonna tell her might look I just take because I told her. I was like, look, I wrote him, I'm gonna talk to him because you know, coming back, I was like, why he's talking the police? Ool man? Look at you. I got that you ain't helping me. I mean, work with me, bro, you know what I was saying. I'm trying to do something like it show. So anyway, Damn, I'm gonna call her. I'm like, look, you need to come down here. You know what I'm saying. And I guess I'm gona talk to her. And I was like, what's your grandma gonna do to try to get those shepherd what is she willing to do? By I spent sell her house two. Hundred and fifty, telling her house an they ain't broke. We're good at that. Man. My grandfather went over to Egypt and Alexandria and shit is opposed in all that nine to eleven shit, Alexandria walked to naval ships. That fucker was making damnary million a. Year, but he had to stay over there three hundred and forty eight days for it to be tax exemper some shit.

1:39:16 The fuckers got paid. Now, they got paid the ship for the day. In the past forty years, since two thousand and one, they got paid. You've got a very good attorney, no, Richard, No. I said, I want to be cold counsel. But at the same time, okay, I'm in here for capital murder charge. Spent eight months. I don't have one piece of paper. You ain't been to sea. I've seen y'all. I've seen my lawyer. Man. Come on, we're friendly people, but you see what i'ming. You understand what I'm getting at though, Okay, no doubt they did. Richard's background checked. Richard good as a motherfucker. You know what I'm saying. But at the same time, come on, man, I've seen y'all more than i've seen my lawyer. Man. Ooh, come see me all be in there next week to see. Man, I ain't seen yet where we're at. Man, just give me a copy of song. You know what I'm saying. Let me see what's going on. Man, All I got is an indictment. Does anybody get up the computer we gave you that?

1:40:03 I think somebody mailed it that the somebody mailed at the South Carolina and Kenny, Yeah, wait did But like I said, I'm all right, all right everything I need to Write'm gonna talk to her Thursday. I'mna tell her to come down here and should tell her come talk to us. So she wants to come talk to us, I got no problem with that. I can't get a visit on over the streets. What's her name? I shouldn't even be a devils. I shouldn't even be on the streets. What dimples and nab it dimples Ida bet and nabin it I n A v I n E nab it. That's but no, I'm gonna talk to her and tell her. I'm like, man, I don't know what I got to do, but.

1:40:44 I'm over this on. But like we said, you know, I mean, we're we're interested in the whole truth. So We'll talk to the State of Tourney and tell them we've talked. Just tell them. Look, it's as simbil as this. I'm willing to do whatever you know what I'm saying it takes to get me at it. And I ain't gonna say I want to do whatever it take to get this murder ship going. Man. I ain't killing nobody. Man, I'm wanting to help work he talk do anything. I ain't kill nobody. I'm not saying the credit card you burn me for that. You know what I'm saying, I did that kidnapp you. I ain't killed out no people. I ain't touch no people. I ain't who eh. Yeah, but you were with them one that did it. I ain't put who you're with, what that did? What is what is with him? Though? What is that? I mean? You were in the car follow on him. Okay, now, I mean that that pretty much kind of sucks. But there you are, Okay, you follow on them and you're talking to them on the next till while you're doing that, do you ever consider that?

1:41:37 So hold on, hold on the boost excuse me, but you said that sell the boost phones. So but you said next toils what you said on. So is there like a specific time these people were supposed to be killed and all this other ship? You tell me to take this out. This is what I'm saying. What if I got am I together? If this is what I'm asking, What if I got proof? You know what I'm saying, not no story, not no fiction, proof that when these people were being killed, I wasn't there. If you have I'm telling you actual prink. I'm gonna tell you, if you have actual proof, then you have the dumbest motherfucker I've ever met my life to withhold that from us, to show that you were somewhere else not hearing what I'm saying. Man, It's not that simple, man, It is that simple. This is your life in the balance, isn't it. Yeah, proof you're not there.

1:42:24 I ain't sitting on that ship that would have come out. But I'm so this is this is where I was checked, that check, that person, that person. Here's the phone numbers here find them. Hear me. That's simple. It's always that simple. No, it's not. Trust me, man, it's not. It might be in Florida, but trust me, it's not what it hard I'm saying. This is all I'm saying if I can get if I can get you proof, not like I said, not no story, not no person coming in to say, oh yeah, he was with me. I'm no bullshit. I'm talking about actual proof. When these puggles were supposed to being buried. Now I was here. I wasn't there. That'll help you. I'm talking about life here. Where's there? Where were you if they Georgia getting buried and I got proof at that time, I wasn't no wing there that ship?

1:43:07 Where were you? Saying? Hey, look at that? You can't even tell me? So I mean, I think you're full of shit. You know what I'm saying. I understand what it looks like. But I'm just saying that will help me? Right? How many? But we've we've danced this dance about a half dozen times right now. And every time you tell me I got some I got some proof. What if I have proof? You ain't never giving me nothing to show that she got that proof? Okay, I can bring you prove not you give me nothing. My grandma comes down there, can bring you. Tell me your You're at Grandma Dimple's house. At no time. But you'll see though, I guarantee you though she'll bring y'all proof, not no staving in no confession. She'll bring you. I look forward to seeing that. And if she has proof, you need to encourage her to come forward because the longer she. Went on her from us, it's not her, it's the problem. Listen, it ain't hurt you. I'm saying, listen, is you gotta understand?

1:43:54 Okay, Okay, look at it, y'all holies, right yea? You notice you know how the streets is? Okay. Alan knows me, Tiffany knows me. Bruce don't really fucking know me. If I said, if something off the wall dude comes in and talks to Alan saying it's about me. You no, No, I ain't gonna say that. If somebody comes in and talk to me and said it's about Alan, but I don't know who the fuck that is, I'm gona be looking at him like it's a cop. Man. That's the first anybody got even beat no cop. That's the first thing that's gonna come to mind. But say Alan's mama comes in there. I know her. You know what I'm saying. I'm gonna work with her. I'm gonna help you know what I'm saying, Look, what can we talk about? You know what I'm saying. Shit like that. Believe me, if it was as simple ast oh, go over here. You know what I'm saying.

1:44:37 Yeah, you can get whatever you again, and you're right. Like I said, from the first night. I said, Man, I was there, Man, I was holding flashlight, man, whatever else. You know what I'm saying. Yeah, in my mind, psychologically, I'm gonna be like this motherfuckers nervous. He just told us the truth. He don't be fucked up. You know what I'm saying. He vined. That's all he did. You know what I'm saying. He finally got that shit off his chest. That's what I would think too. Shit Like I said, you know what, you know what's happening right now. I don't deny that a lot of that shit I told you at first name wasn't true because a. Lot of it was. I'm gonna tell you they told us that first night, okay, about being there when all this happened. I got no doubts about it. Okay, no doubts at all, because you couldn't know at that time what everybody else was telling us. Okay, you couldn't know it you weren't sitting in the room with us when we sat in there with Tiffaney. Okay, well, Thartners were sitting down with Bruce.

1:45:27 There's you no way for you to know what do you mean what was going on during those interviews and what they told us? Right, excuse me? What do you mean? What would it matter what they told Jode? Well, how can you just make some shit up? Okay? How can you just make it up? And it just happened to that. I give it everything that that teel saying. I could have known the exact story exactly, and yet hey, look the stories match. Okay, when it doesn't take it down, Rocket Sign just stalized that told us the trivial feemal. They said, if people got killed a week before y'all the rest of us, that gives me a whole week to find out what. Happened about the only thing that you told me that night that wasn't true it is your degree and abnormal psychology. Although that was a nice touch, I'm telling you, your storyteller, you get at it, man, I just it ain't start telling.

1:46:11 You'd better go sit your ass back in the jail than tell two detectives who's who's whose vow is to seek the truth? I mean, you keep telling us you have this proof, but you won't give it to us. Guy, you prevent me from doing my job. Hey, that's on you. Well how does it? How does it work? You call your lawyer, you tell him what that proof is and he'll tell you whether or not we need to know. Tell him you're gonna call and tell us. See what he says. I told my lawyer, I said, look, I got proofed and can free me. Not freeing, but I told him. I was like, look I got it out of my and I got proof. Man, Okay, I'm gonna be in there zee. I've seen y'all. Boy, I've seen him, and give us what you've got and we'll go verified. But I ain't told him nothing. I said, Look, my grandma will come down here and she will talk to you. They calls, HI will pay you.

1:46:54 I'm gonna tell you ready to tell us the whole truth. But if I call him and tell you, I'm again, look this, this and that and the third, Okay, I'll be in there to see. Man. What wants to go? Verify your alibi or check into it? Tell us what it is. If not we're gonna hook you back and change up takes back over to jail. Obligated to check into it. If you say you have an alibi, we're gonna go check. And what if it clears, I get to go home. If it clears you, then you would go home. Hold on, Hold on one. Look, if you'd absolutely proved, beyond any doubt that you were nowhere near there, had no involvement in the murder, if. You're if you're et dinner a Southeast Miami that week, but I still, well, you'd be in trouble for the credit card stuff. That don't go away. You're trying to tell me what you got a clear proof that says you didn't murder anybody, weren't even around when these people were killed. Okay, well you ain't showing it to me. You ain't give me no proof, So pretty much h tough ship right now?

1:47:45 What about like you said, or to the fact, just to the fact that after. They were killed, I'm a video when he's fucking you a credit card, that's fucked up. If I'm out, if I'm a cop, Okay, these two people are killed and this fuck is cleaning this bank account. Out man out there he said, there was there when he got kidnapped, brut out fling the truck said alive. That that could be the definition of not having a conscience, getting yours. That's all it was about. I mean ship that they don't need it, right, But I said, I ain't killing people. Mm hmm, I said I wouldn't. I wouldn't even have attended to. Kill it, wouldn't. You can you could think for another couple of months and what kind of story about this?

1:48:29 But I know you were there, Okay, I didn't know that. Now, this, this whole other game that you're playing is real. Last bar time, he said, all I gotta all I gotta do is write you and we can sit in front of the state attorney as long as I give him what he needs. Right. No, no, no, that's not what I said. I said, we need the full young truth. Not not not that's what he needs. No no, no, no, no no, that's not I want to be very clear about this. I don't want you to write on a piece of paper, but what you think he would like to hear that might help you out of your case. Hold the full truth of it. Everything you were there for that you saw, who did what, who didn't do? What? What roles everybody played in it? Who got what? Stuff that was split up from them? Okay that we recovered h the stuff that was all taken from the house. Hey, that you guys dim it up and the hoteld him all that stuff, you know, the cheap hotel or even described to budget in when y'all jumped all that stuff out in there and went through again. I want full disclosure, Okay. I don't want bits and pieces. I don't want the part that makes you look good. Okay, I want the full truth. Okay, that's what I want. That's what the state attorney will insist on before he even considered it.

1:49:33 Okay, And I give him all that. I give him exactly that. And like I said, stuff to hell him. And like I said, if I can show the proof that I wasn't there, then he'll work. But he'll help me. He will do everything he can to show if you weren't there, bullet and I'm I'll get Thataddy riting. No, you come over here and tell you. I can't make you a promise. Okay, he has to come over here, now, that's just what you're saying. If if he does that's between you and him. And if he gets and like I said, he gets the whole. Truth, you would have to talk to him about how he wants to hear. And not only would he have to look at it, would have to evaluate it and verify it if you have a credibility issues. Like what I'm saying is I can't I can't tell you what he's gonna do. Okay, what was That's not all wrong? We aren't involved in that part of it.

1:50:14 Our role finders. He proves it. Okay, he proves it, and then what like I said, there's up to you and him. Then what we need to do. That's what I'm ready to do. Well, the first thing we need to do is we need to stop bullshitting us on details. Okay, I'd rather have call my grandma rather than have you look me in the face and say, I don't really want to talk about that right now because I need to evaluate some things and to try to sell me some bullshit. I don't want to evaluate shit. That's what I'm trying to say. Can you call my grandma? I give your phone him, we can call her. He's don't want to be down here. I would have come down here. You're telling her Thursday, call her Thursday when you're supposed to and have her come down. Okay, Can y'all give me a visit? Winnn wait and arrange to have you talk to her. Let's do it, Let's do it. Let's get right, all right, sit tip for him.

1:51:11 I walk straight line, shackle change, Oh gesome girdie, it's calling my name. There is no mercy, and it's been a tentery juice as the Hillstream game wrangled the three. I'm here, be by me or die inside these walls, inside the wild, and't went more girls.

1:51:55 I know it's so Very accola, very ang